Feedback First Feedback in Four Years

[Darth Carnifex]

This is the first time I've posted a feedback thread since 2020, and seeing all the recent ones crop up got me wanting to post one of my own.

This'll be for feedback and constructive criticism for the character of Carnifex, his personal group the Kainate, and the stories written concerning both.

 

[Aris Noble]

There's nothing cooler than a concept. Carnifex has become that, evolving from this big bad evil Sith Lord to a full on concept of evil people have to contend with and realize it's not going to just go away. Is he the eternal embodiment of it? Just the current face of it that will one day be replaced with another? Tons of directions in that regard, but it's lots of fun seeing how he is now.

Only critique I have now if can even be called that is me wanting to see more of his emotions. There was a bug plot point of the fact he got them back after so long without, and I'm fascinated by the idea of seeing if he's either going to relearn how to control them as he once did like a distant memory, or if they're so utterly new because of everything that he has random bouts of intense emotion. Panatha is a prime example. He didn't have these emotions when it went boom, but now that he does, what does he feel?

That's all I got tho keep bein the biggest bad. It's been a blast and I can't see that changing.

 

[Darth Imperius]

I would lie if I would say that I am not a Kainate fanboy. Its literally one of the groups, arcs, stories - when I read them, they make me give it another shot. Not only the current arcs or private threads I follow here and there, but also the big events and gravitas of everything that is happening. It feels like I am reading one of the epic, dark stories where you know the guy is evil, but damn, you like him. That goes especially hard for Carnifex.

The amount of lore you and your companions have accumulated over the years, is breathtaking and truly intriguing. Consistent, immersive, thrilling. Its more than a decade worth of experience and worldbuilding. Congratulations and respect for that.

Looking forward to reading a lot more good stories of an incredible antagonist.

 

[Connel Vanagor]

He is by far the measuring stick for Sith and all Sith activity site wide. I have been around rp for a long time and am honestly wide-eyed at several; of the concepts, posts and ideas that you come up with. Vader was the face of evil for a long time, I think Carni(would he ever become canon) would challenge that all too well,.

My only criticism is the same thing as Aris, dealing with his emotions, how they affect him around his family, his grandkids. How that would affect him around others of the Kainite and Sith in general.

Well done.

 

[Ijaat Mereel]

Needs MOAR death and less LIFE.

Otherwise, ain't bad.

 

[Kaila Irons]

I mean what is there to say about the icon of evil himself? as far as villains go I don't think anyone can ever outdo him, he's been around for so long, done so much, knows so much! I wouldn't call him a god exactly but he's the closest any PC will ever get imo.

I can talk about the Kainate however, as carni's apprentice and a soon to be former kainite myself thanks to upcoming schemes. I admittedly find it difficult to write Kainites, at least in the long term. As a villainous faction, the lore and vibes are fantastic, but in practice i find it difficult to make a compelling story out of kainites as PCs while staying true to that lore. some recent editions especially reminded me that a good, loyal kainite, is better suited to being an NPC, because it feels like the only thing that should be on their mind is the kainate itself, and their personal goals should only be to please Carnifex. In addition to that, while I see Carnifex himself up to his evil schemes all the time, I never really see the Kainate itself? they have no presence in most threads aside from Prazutis on occasion and I don't really see the few active kainite PCs being included or really informed when Carnifex makes big plays.

As a standalone villain, Carnifex is the king of kings. But I personally find it difficult to tag along

 

[Caelan Valoren]

You smell like beef and cheese and you sit on a throne of lies.

 

[Eloise Dinn]

I think you're a good writer with a knack for the social side of RP. You work well with others and pay attention to how they write, customizing how you interact with them based on your observations. But man, I wish you would kill Carni off. The guy has been around for too long and has been stagnant development-wise for years. I used to think he was overrated, but now I think he's just really overdue for a good sendoff.

Unfortunately I think you are too attached to him to give him up. I recall once hearing you say you don't know what you'd do if you stopped writing him. I understand that this is, what, a decade you've put into this character? I'd have a hard time wrapping that up too. But the longer you write him, the fewer people there will be who remember his "glory days". I've been here for 5 years and while I respect you as a writer for your commitment, I can't recall anything Carnifex has done during that time to warrant my interest or respect for him as a character - and I'm not going to give it based on his reputation alone. Whatever he used to be, now he comes across as banal and pretentious, capitalizing his pronouns as if he were God and faffing about with his billion wives or harassing his quadrillion kids. The fact that he's usually relegated to a supportive role, a force of nature who exists to embody evil and antagonize the good guys, makes him tolerable. But if he's just a tool in other people's stories, he might as well be an NPC.

My recommendation would be to give this "legendary" character a dramatic fall from grace. He's got delusions of godhood, he should either get a wakeup call or those delusions should drag him down. Have him suffer a major defeat where he loses something he truly cares about. Or maybe he's paranoid about his legacy and realizes all that he's built won't last. He needs a new character arc, or he needs to be retired or killed off. That's my two cents.

 

[Grrwunhoooll Agaburry]

What I like:

• I will forever standby my opinion that Carnifex's descriptive language and overall verbiage is superb. A++ I can literally construct the exact scene in my head whenever I read a post by you.
• Ive seen teases and nuances of a deeper emotion pool with your character in some private threads and with other character interactions (Namely your interactions with the character Srina Talon ) I enjoy these rare glimpses of this side of Carnifex and it leaves me with intrigue for more. DO more of this. It gives your character more dimensions, even if done in private only. Heck, doing this in private even shows strategy and balance with "vulnerabilities" vs his own reputation as BIG BAD.
• I like the progress of Carnifex transforming into this Elder father figure and monolith of sith culture. The title of "Eternal Father" is very fitting and its a different perspective than past renditions of the character.
• The Kainite. I cant speak too much on this in detail as there is alot i still dont know about the sith philosophy. BUT this creation or addition to the Sith Ethos is well...EXPANSIVE. I appreciate how consistent it is as well, most questions id have are already answered in IC and OOC contexts.

My Critique:

In your last Feedback in 2020, I also gave feed back and i still stand by most of what I posted in 2020. Carnifex as a character has been around for a looonnnngggg time and i personally agree with Eloise Dinn 's feedback and the idea of a character death or a new arc that explores the deeper aspects and that also lets the readers relate to the character more or see the vulnerable internal world of Carnifex. Above I mentioned how I enjoyed emotions, sentiment and feelings shared by the character in some depth, but comparison to the 4 years, I wish you did this sooner.

Carnifex still has the feeling of no real risk at all. Alot of the things he has accomplished and gained fall short in comparison due to the lack of emotion explored. Its shallow feeling. Some is shown but the potential to flush out more is there and I dont understand why it hasn't been in the 4 years since.

The character is as large as Chaos itself (which is quite impressive tbh). The IC reputation Carnifex has I see as the biggest threat to further character development. As I said before on the Kainite. I really like the depth, but Im interested in what the philosophy looks like without Carnifex around or if he took a different arc(insert a conflict, challenge or risk here). I believe it (the kainite) has enough content and context in it to have a life of its own and that would be awesome. Another thing is, its hard to tell what is Kainite and what is Carnifex. Though Carnifex is the literal author and creator of the Kainite, For myself it is hard to see the difference between the creation and creator. Nuance is there for sure but I agree with and think the feedback that Kaila Irons provided on them voices it aptly.

Unfortunately I think you are too attached to him to give him up. I recall once hearing you say you don't know what you'd do if you stopped writing him. I understand that this is, what, a decade you've put into this character? I'd have a hard time wrapping that up too. But the longer you write him, the fewer people there will be who remember his "glory days"

This ^^

There are not many characters that come close to what Carnifex has achieved IC, that is something to be proud of, but the value and beauty in something is not because it lasts forever. It is because it doesn't.

 

[Srina Talon]

Ive seen teases and nuances of a deeper emotion pool with your character in some private threads and with other character interactions (Namely your interactions with the character Srina Talon Srina Talon ) I enjoy these rare glimpses of this side of Carnifex and it leaves me with intrigue for more. DO more of this. It gives your character more dimensions, even if done in private only. Heck, doing this in private even shows strategy and balance with "vulnerabilities" vs his own reputation as BIG BAD.

I'm both chuffed and terrified that you've read those private threads xD - Sweet lawd, have mercy.

While I've always enjoyed the Carnifex ":tm?" writing style, I can freely admit that I enjoy the Carnifex of the now far more than the Carnifex of 2017-2018. It's not that you were doing anything wrong, but a lack of exposure. We only have so much time on our hands, so it gets hard to relate to a character that you've only truly been able to witness through a bird's-eye view or a hella load of tinted glass. The things that make a character have depth and really tick won't be readily available to writers that aren't constantly exposed to the character. They won't be able to see the "nuance" as easily.

And I can say that...Because that was me. I didn't get it, didn't see it, but it was out of my own ignorance - Not dislike.

We wrote one thread back in the day but then drifted (not for any particular reason) for many, many moons. Years. Coming back together and having our characters interact later on REALLY gave me the 411 on what Carnifex is now not what he was then. At some point - He evolved for me. He wasn't just a looming shadow in the dark, distant, brutal, without cause or reason. There was a vision, a story, that I just wasn't privy to just out of a lack of time. I know better now.

It was a situation that happens all too often because we're all just busy...Our character relationships, and plans, get lost in the sauce.

I'm thankful and proud that we crawled our way out of the leftover Tupperware bin. I didn't write Srina for almost two years for a variety of reasons. Your patience, time, and effort played a big part in helping me through that and allowed space for me to branch out and start enjoying writing again. It's a completely different dynamic, different goals, and even, different IC difficulties. It's not just "help me fight" but "help me see the world" because Srina is piss-poor at emotion. It's a perfect dynamic because she's not one of his wives, nor, is she beholden to the Kainate for any reason. Carnifex has no reason to tolerate her...But he does. He's not an "overpowered idea" to me but a multi-faceted character with endless avenues of exploration and growth, even, as lengthy as his wrap sheet is.

So, FWIW, thank you for taking the time to write with me. Thank you for dealing with my pain-in-the-ass character (and pain-in-the-ass me) in stride.

You never know what a little time and effort can do for someone who is struggling. So, ty kindly.

 

[John Locke]

There is a reason that Carnifex has endured through all these years as THE big bad of the site, you've taken one Sith Lord amongst many and managed to build him up into something more than just a mere Sith. Carnifex has become the embodiment of the darkside for Chaos, and everyone from the newest Padawan to the most ancient and wise grandmaster knows and fears him. I don't think that people understand how much work and effort that takes, and what's perhaps more impressive the sheer consistency. You write him as evil, but without going too far and crossing the line into the uncomfortable which is something I really appreciate, that ability to convey dread and terror without having to use shock tactics.

I think an underestimated part of your writing is how willing you are to work with others and help to develop and build up their characters. I don't know that I've ever seen you say no to someone who wants to write with you, you always find a way to interact and help them tell their stories. For someone who's been here so long, that enthusiasm and energy is incredible to see. And it's reflected in those around you and the sheer momentum and connections of the Kainate.

Overall, definately one of my favourite writers to read, and I look forward to seeing what you do with Carnifex going forward.