Star Wars Roleplay: Chaos

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How nice can a Sith be?

Hey all, I'm new here.

Now, when I say "nice", I don't mean fluffy and cute and cuddly.

I mean, can a Sith have good intentions for the galaxy without compromising the Dark Side of the Force?

I'm trying to rationalise out what my character would be like and how he would justify being a part of the Sith.

I don't find much pleasure in writing those crazy types that love to go on killing sprees and are hungry for blood.

A calm, rational man that truly believes Sith philosophy is for the good of society, one where order reigns, where criminal activity can be crushed with an iron fist and people can have true peace?

Do Sith have to be selfish, and self-seeking? Does it inhibit the Dark Side if they do not serve themselves, but the "greater good" as they perceive it?

(Or perhaps another faction would be better suited to such a worldview?)
 
The Admiralty
In the grand scheme of things we are writing a story, in that same scheme of things you can write your character just the way you like it. Fact is that canonically it is more than implied and showed that the Dark Side corrupts, that even the best intentions can become warped and become a mockery.

See Jacen Solo etc.

That being said, well-meaning extremist ain't exactly new and is definitely not outside the scope of possibilities.
 
If I remember correctly, I believe the Sith had their primary intentions to rule the galaxy as they saw fit, as they thought in their meditation and power from the Dark Side of the Force, that the way they do things is "right", or "good". This is just to the extent of my current knowledge on the subject. If you're looking for necessarily "nice" or "good guys," I would recommend looking into the Grey Jedi. Hope I helped.
 
[member="Wolf"]

Feel free to roleplay how'd you like. It's your character and thus ultimately your decision. Besides, I always find that 'good' and 'evil' is quite a subjective term :)

In fact, there have already been a few Sith Lords on the board (I believe) who have sought the greater good but still embraced the Sith principles that the strong should rule the weak... Think of it like trying to be a benevolent autocrat. You may seek to uphold higher moral standards and a principle of eliminating crime and protecting the peace but still place ultimate authority in the Sith.
 
[member="Wolf"]

The dark side is most likely called such because of the fact that the jedi won the early wars and history is written by the victors


Reguardless the dark side draws more upon the emotions of the weirder and it is up to the weilder in question what emotion they channel and how much of that emotion.

A Sith who is infatuated with himself is certsin,y capable of benefiting those around him. If you wish the best for yourself then you wish to have strong servants beneath you giving more power. Order above the rest, a single entity deciding over the stagnent republic, could be seen as best for the world...the grater good could be to serve the empire, or the one Sith, and bring things under one order.
 
[member="Wolf"]

I've always written my Sith as ultimately 'nice', primarily because the role of the Sith is not to be self-serving, egotistical and sadistic - that, sadly enough, is a byproduct of their philosophy, which states that strength is that which should be respected above all. This derives from both evolutionary and political understanding: the 'strong' ultimately survive in conditions where life is unable to thrive, either through overt force or having the ability to adapt to changing circumstances (much as Darwin suggested). That latter part is why Sith training ultimately focuses upon enduring trials and challenges - those capable of being effective Sith ultimately survive them (intact or otherwise), while weaker, less-deserving candidates fail (and usually die).

This moves onto political views: essentially, the Sith believe that the weak should rule over the strong, simply because they have the power and insight (both from experience and the Force) to maintain peaceful order. In essence, the strong rule and any opposition to this, or from those who might seek to subvert the system (smugglers, pirates etc) are destroyed as the threat to the system. This cannot work in a Democracy unless there is a strong military power base (which the Republic traditionally did not maintain) - in essence, anything that acts outside the defined parameters of the system are destroyed through massive force. This extends as much to personal power as it does to political and military power. An individual Sith must be strong in order to rule - they must be able to use their wit, cunning, intelligence and brute force capabilities to maintain their status. After all, a weak person can be walked over by those who choose to ignore them. That can't be said for a Sith: to oppose one is to sign your own death warrant.

Sadly, this understanding tends to be corrupted by the Sith themselves: as each Sith trains, they are forced to overcome challenges and become stronger through dealing with adversity. As they do so, they ultimately see themselves as part of the Elite, whether in truth or through aspiration. As such, everyone beneath them is weak, and Sith ideology often (incorrectly) suggests that what is weak should be destroyed. In truth, the Sith suggest that the weaker need to be controlled and led - thus leading to that sense of Sith superiority/domination. Since other Sith can't be controlled, if they are weaker, they are opposition rather than subordinates, which is how most arguments and battles among the Sith start: one sees themselves as superior and seeks to assert dominance, the other resists, and so they fight until one is dead. This is why the One Sith doctrine operates here: all Sith are required to understand that they serve the Emperor's will, and thus must focus on a higher purpose.

Thus, what we come to is the doctrine of useful resource: if it can be used or put to functional purpose, it will be. Where some Sith would slaughter an entire army to make a point, others would simply kill the one or two at the top of the hierarchy in order to end resistance, then turn that force into one that will fight for the Empire, thus repurposing them. The simple key is that you don't waste anything that can be useful: thus, being an ethical Sith is a question of pragmatism. You *could* kill entire planetary populations to assert your power, or you can capture them, put them to use as a means of strengthening your power base and widening the scope of your authority.

Ethical Sith are ultimately those who work purely to benefit the Empire: that's the role of each Sith, according to the Emperor's vision. You don't randomly kill people, because they could be put to the service of the Empire in turn - everyone has a function to fulfil. Thus, the sadistic acts of killing go away - the Sith serves to strengthen the Empire, and achieves this through strengthening themselves and also from using their strength as an extension of that belonging to the Empire as a whole. We're not here to butcher all who bother us.
 
Star Wars is not a complex morality piece.

The Dark Side is inherently evil, and those who use it have their good intentions twisted and perverted.

So yes, one might start as a Sith with noble intent and set out to be a good person, but one will find that the Dark Side eventually turns this into selfishness and base emotions.

It is your story, but please let us not have a repeat of any 'kindly Sith', of the Enton mould (as some veterans of the craftshop may recall).
 
[member="Wolf"]

No, they do not have to be selfish. Jacen Solo was not selfish. In fact, he succeeded in his goals. Palpatine was also not entirely selfish. He united the entire galaxy and, whether or not people liked it, brought about an age of peace. Now, that says nothing to his humanocentric policies and enslavement and genocide of alien species, but even so his accomplishment was remarkable in the same way that Stalin's industrialization of Russia was remarkable.


My Sith, Orcus, for instance is a convert from the Jedi. He does not believe in wanton slaughter or power for power's sake: example, he owns an orphanage on Coruscant. All he seeks is an establishment of peace and prosperity in the galaxy. He believes the best way to do that is to establish a galactic empire led by a few key intellectual Sith. In order to achieve that end he will use any and all means.
 
[member="Tirdarius"]

Wow, wonderfully thought out response, exactly the kind of thing I was looking for, I could definitely see myself making a character like that.
 
[member="Hion the Herglic"]

Interesting! Though I wonder how does your character get along with the sadistic murderous psychopaths he sometimes has to work with?
 
Fabula Caromed said:
...Yeah, I guess it's been at least a week since we've had a thread like this. <_<
This doesn't seem like the typical 'are sith actually evil?' and more of the "can a dark side character start out, or generally be, well meaning?" sort. A dark side user can mean well- they just generally won't go about doing things in the best way. Eventually their continued use of the dark side will corrupt them, and while it's possible for them to still think they're doing good, they won't be 99.99% of the time.

What they do might bring some good things about, but the ends do not justify the means.
 
[member="Wolf"]
Star Wars deals in absolutes. This isn't an IC survey or opinion, you're asking for an OOC opinion.

It's quite clear, Dark Side is evil, Light Side is good. It's simplistic, sometimes even absurdly so, but this is the universe we play in.

Thus, someone who uses the Dark Side is going to fall eventually no matter their intentions. That's just how it is in Lucas' universe.
 
A human (or an alien) is a human (or an alien).

Start from your character's personality and motives and build up from there, what comes organically is king, and you might find yourself surprised along the way.

George Lucas is fortunately not on SWRP: Chaos to enforce morality upon you.
 

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