Some brain for your brawn

[Sentiri]

So with certain elements of the First Order being restructured and streamlined, I thought I'd pose a few questions. I'm not sure any of this really matters to most folks, but I would like to have some mindset of what I'm doing, so here I am.

I've been gone for a few months and I'd like to pick this character back up again and am trying to make sense of a good place to put her. Sentiri will always be Intel. But what is the Ubiqtorate within this faction? Or even, what could it be?

Last time, when I tried to structure the Intelligence department, we grouped them with the military. It's a logical choice. Most members see action and intrigue as two adjectives under the same umbrella. And what's intrigue without some explosions? The Intel groups automatically get involved in anything that the military does... and the military gets to boast about how much higher their test scores have gotten while still maintaining their blaster rifle proficiency. Win, win.

Also logical considering the military will almost always have a larger member base than Intel; but if we make the two seem more similar, maybe some folks who were on the fence would choose Intel over Army or Navy for whatever reason someone would want to choose between them.

However. We also have those government folks over there, and they always need something to do. They also deserve the same inclusive treatment, and something as basic as infrastructure (that thing your parents love arguing about and you love tuning out) can potentially solve that problem.

My thought is the following: Intel has always bridged the gap between the military and the government, both in terms of roleplay and in real life applications. By putting Intel under the government branch, the elements of the Intel department that are naturally government-oriented will feel more at home while also giving the government folks a more logical bridge to adjoining military operations, who really need no incentive to blow things up anyway. Plus, outlined in the current government structure (I have no idea if that is still official but it seems accurate) is a position that covers everything that a Director of Intelligence would do... without the necessity of adding needless ranks that may, or may not, be ever filled by an actual PC.

What are your thoughts?

...Or just hi, I'm that writer who talks a lot and I'm back and ready to get to writing some nifty intrigue minus the explosions .... ok maybe some explosions ... but only some.

 

[Aram Kalast]

[member="Sentiri"]
The points raised are valid and something I've had a lot of thought into.

For the restructure I removed Intelligence for the simple fact that as of yet I have no idea how to proceed with them. As mentioned we had them piggy-backing the military and yes it worked. (by the way I have simply moved the intel write up to an archive. We still have it).

Now the government does need something, but I don't want it to be suddenly every Moff is an agent in disguise.

So I am thinking of re-opening Intelligence under a new banner. The First Order Security Bureau. Which will operate as their own branch with their own ranks and their own little page. I just need to give it more structural thought.

 

[Natasi Fortan]

I actually think such a bureau SHOULD have its own ranks and whatnot, it should exist under the purview of the Ministry for Security in the Government. The leader of the security bureau would be a Moff also serving as Minister for Security (in the current iteration of our government, the Grand Moff is a sort of "Prime Minister" figure, with each Moff on the Moff Council carrying a portfolio [Security, Foreign Relations, Development, etc.] in which they can provide expert advice to the Grand Moff and high command officials).

Each of these subgroups could, in theory, have their own rank structure (Agent/Special Agent/Lead Agent or whatever) but wouldn't need to be fleshed out until we had PCs in them. But I do think the security/intelligence group under the Government makes sense. That way it can exist when there are PCs but wouldn't be this empty forum without activity when there aren't.

Activity breeds activity so the more we can concentrate and make the forums active, the better we will be, I think (and, I will be taking my own medicine in them government forums this week/weekend!).

[member="Aram Kalast"] | [member="Sentiri"]

 

[Sentiri]

[member="Aram Kalast"]

I concur with the structure suggested by [member="Natasi Fortan"]. In simple form:

Moff > Department Heads > Special Agents > Agents

I don't think it has to be any more complicated than that, especially considering member density. The progression is clear, and whatever an Agent decides to do within the Bureau is great. As you say, activity breeds activity. The format I had before included some potentially needless structure, but was still a good outline of duties that an Intel operative could perform. I'd be more than happy to try and rework that into something more appropriate for our current meta.

I also share your reservations about having a bunch of government/Intel hybrids running amok. But as long as there is only one Moff position at the head of Intel, and the rest of Intel is clearly defined as being "Agents" and the government folk are clearly defined as "Governors" then I think we're ok.

 

[Arahael]

The truth is, generally Moff's roles and duties were so ambiguous that they had little to no oversight in things they did. They were essentially over-funded people who led just about anything you can think of, and some rarely paid much attention to the government processes that were going on in their own sectors. I understand people not wanting Moffs acting in the field much, but I'd personally say they probably spent more time in the field than most other government officials, especially if they were able to manage all the underground connections and operations that certain Moffs suddenly had at the fragmentation of the Empire.

 

[Natasi Fortan]

The truth is, generally Moff's roles and duties were so ambiguous that they had little to no oversight in things they did. They were essentially over-funded people who led just about anything you can think of, and some rarely paid much attention to the government processes that were going on in their own sectors.

Inefficiency? Ambiguity? In my government?

 

[Dunames Lopez]

Perhaps the Moffs that actually were watching over the governance of their respective sectors were the first to defect once Darth Sidious died its first death... hopefully the FO will have a different attitude towards government.

 

[Sentiri]

[member="Max Fel"]

Our system in the First Order would be different from the traditional Imperial Intelligence system. Back when Ysanne Isard was Director, she answered pretty much directly to the Emperor. The same could be said of nearly every portion of the Empire, from the Moff Council to the military to Vader himself. Such a chaotic system was only kept in check out of fear and reverence for the Emperor. It proved considerably flawed considering the in-fighting the poor infrastructure caused; most of all when the Emperor died.

And sure, Moffs did everything from Intelligence to military command. But the term "Moff" became a catchall that wasn't just ambiguous as to their role within the Empire but even needed retconning from numerous Star Wars authors to better try and interpret what a "Moff" was. The First Order has [member="Natasi Fortan"] for all of our retconning needs... so clearly defined duties I'm sure

The hope is that this type of streamlined infrastructure would not only OOCly provide interactions for our members and bridge gaps between one department to another, but it would also create an IC accountability for department heads. Checks and balances, in a sense. So there are multiple levels behind this retooling of Intelligence.

 

[Davin Jusik]

[member="Sentiri"]
Welcome comrade from a half chiss Stormie.

 

[Arahael]

Speaking of streamlining, I'm assuming since the position of Darth and the powers of Grand Admiral have been abolished, that Grand Vizier and the Imperial Ruling Council have gone been thrown out as well?
Also, many Moffs simultaneosly held the rank of Surface Marshal (Field Marshal) that may tighten things up as well.

 

[Sentiri]

Don't quote me but Grand Admiral is still listed as an attainable rank within the Navy. "Darth" wasn't abolished as the Knights of Ren is a different kind of Sith Order from the traditional.

As for the Grand Vizier, there's really no need for such a position. In OOC terms it's a duplicate rank that covers everything that the Grand Moff would. The same can be said of the Imperial Ruling Council versus the Moff Council. I think it's more important to focus on filling out the ranks that we have before flooding the faction with ones that will only ever be sat on by an NPC, if referenced at all.

Again, this is only to my understanding, as I am pleb, born of meager origins.

At any rate, I'll see if I can't get a revised Intel manifesto written up and I'll post it here for edits, critiques, and ego boosters.

[member="Amin Garith"] Greetings! Half-Chiss you say? I honestly am not sure how Sentiri would react to that knowledge. Sounds like something needing to be tested at some point.

 

[Davin Jusik]

[member="Sentiri"]
If Sentri's a Field type I'm sure they'll run into each other at some point.

 

[Alasdair Sitra]

Here is what I'm thinking at the moment. (Aram btw)

We will assign a Moff with the title of Director of Intelligence, they will be the IC operator of the First Order Imperial Bureau of Security. In this faction (Government) I will make an additional rank page for those wanting to play as agents.

Basically the Bureau will be a sub-faction extension of the Government that will allow them to seamlessly move between all necessary areas of activity.

Cool?

 

[Arahael]

Sounds good.

 

[Sentiri]

Sounds great to me. Just let me know if you need help with setting anything up!

 

[Cyran Khun]

[member="Sentiri"]

In canon, the ISB is heavily tied in with the military, as seen with Agent Terrex and Agent Kallus. But, they function quite differently.
During the Empire days, the ISB targeted threats, smothered out rebels, and micromanaged smaller thorns in the Empire's side, whereas the First Order ISB functions as more of a special ops. After all, you can't just expect stormtroopers to locate the map to Luke Skywalker.
As said above by [member="Thurman"] , I propose we make the ISB a whole new subfaction, with a separate leadership, and objective. We could function as a special ops, focusing more on smaller missions, rather than the larger dominations or military assignments.
In any case, I'd be happy to help whatever comes out of the Ubiqutorate.

Rather than a Moff, we should implement a Director. Brand new title. They could work alongside the Government, and be able to call upon the military?

 

[Sentiri]

[member="Cyran Khun"]

Yeah, I did all of that research when I initially set up the previous incarnation of the First Order's Intelligence. And while the ISB was a truly fearsome organization, it often worked in opposition to other segments of the Imperial military and government.

The idea behind having a Moff in charge rather than a Director serves several functions. ICly, a Moff will tie all parts of the First Order's operations together under a clearly defined hierarchy that will hopefully promote progression (the First Order being the epitome of a meritocracy) but keep in-fighting to a minimum (the downfall of every Sith faction ever).

From an OOC standpoint, it does two things. The first is that it reduces the number of positions required. That isn't a concession, it's simply a practicality. As we get more members, Intel can expand to accommodate, but as it is just starting out, we don't just want to have a plethora of NPCs running about taking away potential interesting spots for PCs. The other thing it does is provide a bridge between the government folks and the military folks. It can be difficult to force interactions when they otherwise seem unnecessary, so having a logical connection between one and the other will hopefully help to promote that.

But that was just my idea. I'll go along with whatever.

(Also, welcome to the First Order! )

Edit: The benefit of having an affiliated minor faction, however, means that the First Order also has an avenue to pursue Rebellions on its own. Just a strategy meta-game thing to keep in mind.

 

[Cyran Khun]

[member="Sentiri"]

You're right there. Having a Moff is practical- I just thought we could develop more positions in the organization, for originality's sake. Honestly, as long as there's some type of administration, I don't mind what the leader is called. Plus, the connection to the government and military is smart, and could help us jumpstart the Ubiqutorate.

All in all, having an Intelligence Bureau is a really good idea. I hate meta-gaming an rp, but it'd give us an edge against other factions.

(Thanks, man! I'm trying to expand my post count, and hope my character snowballs from interacting in OORP threads. This Ubiqutorate seems like a good idea to put my agent right in the middle of things.)

 

[Sentiri]

[member="Cyran Khun"]

I hear you. Meta-gaming is not something I like to partake in. The writing and interaction is what I'm here for. Rebellions just happen to be the craze these days it seems. And I think the idea of an Intel group starting a rebellion somewhere is actually an awesome idea, and fitting considering our shifty backgrounds.

As for threads, snowball away! We have a dominion on Thakwaa that you could join right away. And there has been some planning concerning another thread that should launch soon. You're welcome to join our little crew there!

 

[Cyran Khun]

[member="Sentiri"]

Thanks! I've been reluctant to join the dominion since im a huge noob I don't know what to do, but I'll look into it.