ASA Naval Suggestions

[Onrai]

So I did some comparing between some of what Subach currently has for sale, and between what the ASA currently has in front-line service, and I wanted to make some suggestions for replacement. If implemented at all, I would expect such to happen after Naboo, since it seems that invasion's being used as an excuse to start scrapping Guy-built tech.

CURRENT vs Subach

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Ventress-class Light Cruiser vs Massassi-class Corvette
Current pros: Good gun-to-length ratio, SLAM system, minimal crew, faster hyperdrive
Current cons: Very weak individually, no backup hyperdrive, made by Verd
Subach pros: Has three times the heavy guns for being twice as long, has more AA guns, has torpedo launcher, is more durable, has backup hyperdrive
Subach cons: Slower main hyperdrive(could be upgraded), larger crew

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Escort Frigate(no current ship) vs Kressh-class Frigate
Current pros: N/A
Current cons: N/A
Subach pros: Flexible roles, has ample armament and hyperdrive, has a hangar bay
Subach cons: Large crew count, low consumable count for its length

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Scintel-class Cruiser vs Adamith-class Artillery Cruiser
Current pros: Backup hyperdrive, less minimal crew, higher rated main hyperdrive, higher sublight speed, hangar space
Current cons: Too mixed an armament, not as well armored, less consumables, made by Verd
Subach pros: Much more powerful main guns, ranked as longer range during fleeting, has cluster missile launchers, has energy torpedo launchers, more durable hull
Subach cons: Less AA armament, no fighter space

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Pilar-class Heavy Cruiser vs Yorika-class Heavy Artillery Cruiser
Current pros: Large forward armament, excellent armament of ion cannons, higher rated hyperdrive, backup hyperdrive
Current cons: Most armament is forward mounted, weaker hull
Subach pros: More turbolaser-type armament, less optimal crew, energy torpedo launchers, cluster missile launchers, stronger hull
Subach cons: Minimal ion cannon armament, less overall long-range weaponry

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Stealth Light Star Destroyer(no current ship) vs Attrition-class Light Star Destroyer
Current pros: N/A
Current cons: N/A
Subach pros: Fits stealth generator(could be upgraded to Stygium), ample armament, ample fighter space, two backup hyperdrives
Subach cons: Is double-blind when cloaked, must pre-plot waypoints, not as well armed as the Tambor

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Grievous-class Star Destroyer vs Pluton-class Battleship
Current pros: Heavy close-range armament, mixed armament, assault-based hangar complement
Current cons: No fighter cover, no prefabricated garrison base
Subach pros: Heavy long-range armament, fighter complement, prefabricated base, seperate power for backup hyperdrive
Subach cons: Lack of gunships and dropships, less consumables

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Lucrehulk-class Command Carrier vs Ranator-class Star Destroyer
Current pros: More hangar space, more anti-fighter cover, heavily armored
Current cons: Only minor production, three times as wide as the Ranator, no secondary backup hyperdrive
Subach pros: Adequate anti-warship armament, smaller size, carries a prefabricated garrison base
Subach cons: Weaker hull, less hangar space

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TIE Exalt vs Solace MMS-0510.A2 Starfighter
Current pros: More speedy and maneuverable, smaller size
Current cons: Less well-protected
Subach pros: Heavier armament, chaff and flares, fold-up wings, better protection
Subach cons: Less speedy and maneuverable

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TIE Havoc vs Trident-class Light Bomber
Current pros: Smaller size
Current cons: Structurally weaker, less ordnance capacity
Subach pros: Faster, more maneuverable, more ordnance capacity, more durable, equipped with a hyperdrive
Subach cons: Based off an older design

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Heavy Bomber(no current ship) vs Detritus-class Heavy Bomber
Current pros: N/A
Current cons: N/A
Subach pros: Massive ordnance capacity, heavy firepower, excessively durable
Subach cons: Slow, unmaneuverable

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Arcturus-class Gunboat vs Archer-class Gunship
Current pros: Small, reliable
Current cons: Weak, underarmed
Subach pros: Heavily armed, durable
Subach cons: Slower, less maneuverable
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Other recommendations:
Add TIE Hound to Scout Vessels
Create Support Craft section
Add Guardian-class Sentry Gun to Space Stations/Satellites
Add Aleidine-class Beacon to Space Stations/Satellites
Add Tyderium-class Hyperspace Tug, Fragmentor-class Target Drone, Gypsy-class Electronic Shuttle, Tyzzeph-class Gas Miner, Tryton-class Cargo Hauler, Reclaimer-class Repair Ship, and Centaurus-class Resupply Ship to Support Craft

Spoiler

[member="Anesia Jy'Vun"] [member="Salem Norongachi"] [member="Raziel"] [member="Atretes Rhoujen"]

 

[EmKay]

Hi, [member="Enigma"], I'll be judging your submission today. I'll leave to [member="Irys Arist'lar"] to do a more comprehensive review, since she's the Naval officer and likely going to be the Fleet Admiral (want a job?), but anyway, let us get on with it.

Ventress-class Light Cruiser vs Massassi-class Corvette
Current pros: Good gun-to-length ratio, SLAM system, minimal crew, faster hyperdrive
Current cons: Very weak individually, no backup hyperdrive, made by Verd
Subach pros: Has three times the heavy guns for being twice as long, has more AA guns, has torpedo launcher, is more durable, has backup hyperdrive
Subach cons: Slower main hyperdrive(could be upgraded), larger crew

I like the name Massassi more than Ventress, but that's because I dislike the Confederacy (even before the Chaos-aligned Banthanech, I never liked the Confederacy). However, I like the way the Ventress looks over the way the Massassi does, though arguably the Massassi fits the recent aesthetic more. The biggest cons I can see on the Ventress is that it has no backup Hyperdrive and is made by Verd. If we can reskin the Massassi and/or add in a better 'drive, then I don't see a problem with the switch from my casul scrub "I don't know how ships work in Chaos" point of view.

Escort Frigate(no current ship) vs Kressh-class Frigate
Current pros: N/A
Current cons: N/A
Subach pros: Flexible roles, has ample armament and hyperdrive, has a hangar bay
Subach cons: Large crew count, low consumable count for its length

An escort frigate could be useful. Unless you're missing something and there actually is one around, this seems like it ties in with "We want only one ship for every type".

Scintel-class Cruiser vs Adamith-class Artillery Cruiser
Current pros: Backup hyperdrive, less minimal crew, higher rated main hyperdrive, higher sublight speed, hangar space
Current cons: Too mixed an armament, not as well armored, less consumables, made by Verd
Subach pros: Much more powerful main guns, ranked as longer range during fleeting, has cluster missile launchers, has energy torpedo launchers, more durable hull
Subach cons: Less AA armament, no fighter space

Let's see... this one's tricky. We could probably do a reforge of either ship and bring it up to spec, as is what I'd probably want to do. Upgrade the Scintel or put some hangars and AA on the Adamith.

Pilar-class Heavy Cruiser vs Yorika-class Heavy Artillery Cruiser
Current pros: Large forward armament, excellent armament of ion cannons, higher rated hyperdrive, backup hyperdrive
Current cons: Most armament is forward mounted, weaker hull
Subach pros: More turbolaser-type armament, less optimal crew, energy torpedo launchers, cluster missile launchers, stronger hull
Subach cons: Minimal ion cannon armament, less overall long-range weaponry

With these, you have to consider what the Pillar is used for. It hangs back away and shoots things, almost like a sniper. Snipers are lightly armoured and staring down a scope, so it's a similar principle. It's a highly-specialised ship, and I'd recommend to Irys that she consider making another heavy cruiser to fill a more battlefield role if one doesn't exist.

Stealth Light Star Destroyer(no current ship) vs Attrition-class Light Star Destroyer
Current pros: N/A
Current cons: N/A
Subach pros: Fits stealth generator(could be upgraded to Stygium), ample armament, ample fighter space, two backup hyperdrives
Subach cons: Is double-blind when cloaked, must pre-plot waypoints, not as well armed as the Tambor

No stealth? Why? We need stealth, stealth is fun.

Grievous-class Star Destroyer vs Pluton-class Battleship
Current pros: Heavy close-range armament, mixed armament, assault-based hangar complement
Current cons: No fighter cover, no prefabricated garrison base
Subach pros: Heavy long-range armament, fighter complement, prefabricated base, seperate power for backup hyperdrive
Subach cons: Lack of gunships and dropships, less consumables

Ah yes, your Pluton. That pride-and-joy you've been working your fingernails off about. As per the Ventress, I like it already on the principle that the Greivous is a Confederate-based name, but are they both Command ships?

Lucrehulk-class Command Carrier vs Ranator-class Star Destroyer
Current pros: More hangar space, more anti-fighter cover, heavily armored
Current cons: Only minor production, three times as wide as the Ranator, no secondary backup hyperdrive
Subach pros: Adequate anti-warship armament, smaller size, carries a prefabricated garrison base
Subach cons: Weaker hull, less hangar space

Irys is working on a Lucrehulk 2.0, I'd take a look at that. Should be in R&D.

TIE Exalt vs Solace MMS-0510.A2 Starfighter
Current pros: More speedy and maneuverable, smaller size
Current cons: Less well-protected
Subach pros: Heavier armament, chaff and flares, fold-up wings, better protection
Subach cons: Less speedy and maneuverable

B-But I like TIE Fighters! Shove the Solace goodies in the TIE shell, or something. The Exalt looks like it suffers from the usual TIE LN drawbacks, by this summary.

TIE Havoc vs Trident-class Light Bomber
Current pros: Smaller size
Current cons: Structurally weaker, less ordnance capacity
Subach pros: Faster, more maneuverable, more ordnance capacity, more durable, equipped with a hyperdrive
Subach cons: Based off an older design

For the purpose of bombing, the Trident seems like a better alternative, honestly. ON the other side of the coin, it's a filthy Rebel Scum model.

Heavy Bomber(no current ship) vs Detritus-class Heavy Bomber
Current pros: N/A
Current cons: N/A
Subach pros: Massive ordnance capacity, heavy firepower, excessively durable
Subach cons: Slow, unmaneuverable

I didn't even know a heavy bomber was a thing. What's it do that a regular bomber doesn't?

Arcturus-class Gunboat vs Archer-class Gunship
Current pros: Small, reliable
Current cons: Weak, underarmed
Subach pros: Heavily armed, durable
Subach cons: Slower, less maneuverable

Am I reading this right? Archer is a prototype? I see why you put "reliable" in the Arcturus pros. I'm kind of nervous putting a proto on the line.

Other recommendations:
Add TIE Hound to Scout Vessels
Create Support Craft section
Add Guardian-class Sentry Gun to Space Stations/Satellites
Add Aleidine-class Beacon to Space Stations/Satellites
Add Tyderium-class Hyperspace Tug, Fragmentor-class Target Drone, Gypsy-class Electronic Shuttle, Tyzzeph-class Gas Miner, Tryton-class Cargo Hauler, Reclaimer-class Repair Ship, and Centaurus-class Resupply Ship to Support Craft

This is 100% up to Irys on what she wants to do with the Navy. Her plans, fleet arrangement, etc. I don't want to step on toes in the manner of who's in charge, so I can't yay or nay adding more ships.

 

[Onrai]

I like the name Massassi more than Ventress, but that's because I dislike the Confederacy (even before the Chaos-aligned Banthanech, I never liked the Confederacy). However, I like the way the Ventress looks over the way the Massassi does, though arguably the Massassi fits the recent aesthetic more. The biggest cons I can see on the Ventress is that it has no backup Hyperdrive and is made by Verd. If we can reskin the Massassi and/or add in a better 'drive, then I don't see a problem with the switch from my casul scrub "I don't know how ships work in Chaos" point of view.

The hyperdrive can definitely be updated. These ships were originally built for the Sith Empire, so I see little to no issue regarding tinkering with that. Would prefer to keep the picbase, if only for the fact that it looks enough like the Kressh to explain the description.

An escort frigate could be useful. Unless you're missing something and there actually is one around, this seems like it ties in with "We want only one ship for every type".

I checked. If there's an escort frigate, I don't see it.

Let's see... this one's tricky. We could probably do a reforge of either ship and bring it up to spec, as is what I'd probably want to do. Upgrade the Scintel or put some hangars and AA on the Adamith.

Putting a hangar on the Adamith can be done.

With these, you have to consider what the Pillar is used for. It hangs back away and shoots things, almost like a sniper. Snipers are lightly armoured and staring down a scope, so it's a similar principle. It's a highly-specialised ship, and I'd recommend to Irys that she consider making another heavy cruiser to fill a more battlefield role if one doesn't exist.

From what I see, both are long-range warships. Artillery vessels, for better lack of term. Only difference seems to be that the Yorika has superior close-range protection in exchange for less high-powered ion weaponry, but fair enough.

No stealth? Why? We need stealth, stealth is fun.

Stealth is good, stealth is sweet.

Ah yes, your Pluton. That pride-and-joy you've been working your fingernails off about. As per the Ventress, I like it already on the principle that the Greivous is a Confederate-based name, but are they both Command ships?

The Grievous and the Pluton both have nearly comparable armament, but the Pluton has more fighters and longer-ranged guns, whereas the Grievous has shorter ranged weaponry. The Pluton's ability to strike first would definitely be a key asset in strikes against the OP.

Irys is working on a Lucrehulk 2.0, I'd take a look at that. Should be in R&D.

Fair enough, but even if upgraded to 2.0 status, it won't be mass-produced, unlike the Ranator. Could say the same about the Tulak Hord, but it's a Sienar product >_>

B-But I like TIE Fighters! Shove the Solace goodies in the TIE shell, or something. The Exalt looks like it suffers from the usual TIE LN drawbacks, by this summary.

Doing that simple solution would be complicated by the current Subach-Sienar business situation. Chief benefit of the Solace is that it can survive multiple missiles due to chaff and flares. One missile, and the Exalt's good as scrap.

For the purpose of bombing, the Trident seems like a better alternative, honestly. ON the other side of the coin, it's a filthy Rebel Scum model.

Aesthetics mean little over performance. The Trident does have the capability to fire both guided ordnance(proton torpedoes) and dropped ordnance(proton bombs), so the flexibility's there.

Am I reading this right? Archer is a prototype? I see why you put "reliable" in the Arcturus pros. I'm kind of nervous putting a proto on the line.

Archer was originally designed as a test ship to test the heavy composite beam laser, hence the reference to "prototype." It was successfully tested in the New Order.

This is 100% up to Irys on what she wants to do with the Navy. Her plans, fleet arrangement, etc. I don't want to step on toes in the manner of who's in charge, so I can't yay or nay adding more ships.

Will ask about that.

[member="Atretes Rhoujen"]

 

[Raziel]

Thanks for going through this [member="Enigma"]

For escort frigate, see the Sickle.

Ok could the three heavy hypervelocity guns on the Adamith be swapped for one long range? If so I'd definitely like some of those to add energy torpedo and hypervelocity cannon punch to the long range arsenal.

Happy to add a limited number of stealth star destroyers and pluton class.

I'll also add TIE Hounds and look at the support ships soon.

 

[Onrai]

[member="Raziel"]

What about the Massassi corvette, if I may ask?

The sickle seems to be listed more as an assault frigate than an escort frigate, what with the mostly forward-mounted weaponry and all.

Unfortunately, the Adamith's guns can't be swapped out. However, the Yorika heavy cruiser has three hypervelocity guns, along with energy torpedo launchers as well. Both ships are designed upon the same lines - heavy forward mounted armament, with long-range energy torpedoes to back it up.

Hope you get a chance to look at the smaller fighter and bomber craft as well. It should prove to be equally intriguing.

 

[Raziel]

The question on the massassi is really how it lines up with the template. (and what that may or may not mean in future)

The ventress has the max gun allocation for its class.

 

[Onrai]

http://starwarsrp.net/topic/30553-annihilator-class-boarding-shuttles/ - The Annihilator boarding shuttle.

And http://starwarsrp.net/topic/14401-tie-spectre/ - the TIE Spectre stealth fighter.

The Massassi in question is still approved. All tech pre-new template will remain approved. Thus, it's admittedly the better option. And to be fair - the hyperdrive's never played into how fleet battles have played out. IC, I suppose it would be rationale to supplement and not fully replace the Ventress, assuming I can't get the hyperdrive updated.

[member="Raziel"]

 

[Salem Norongachi]

Looking at our armoury throughout this invasion, I have found a lack of organic transport. Like we have a ground one but its droids only. We need to find a medium between droid and fleshbags.

If you guys want, you can help me fill in the holes for our ground troops?

 

[Barkt Melan]

[member="Salem Norongachi"]
The Holepunch could be used as a transport, but it's limited in how much it can carry. Once the Factory opens again, I could make a variant of it for troop transport.