Martial Arts and godmodding

[Orick T'ane]

I know what he considers reasonable and he trusts that I won't abuse his trust.

That's it in a nutshell, it's about building trust with the people you write with, shared storytelling has to have a solid foundation of trust. I tate the WWE approach to duels and fighting. It doesn't have to be really dangerous all the time, but you have to sell it. Selling it means that you take hits and sometimes you bleed. but in the end it's always about crafting a good story. Something to look back on and be proud to share with other people.

 

[Mel'sivlal Huedain]

Though I respect what a lot of the fol here had to say, it begs the question that if everyone always operated like that, then almost all PVP could be described in one word, "miss."

Am I saying anyone should be able to kill someone without their consent? Heck no. But yes, auto hits are sometimes needed to get things away from a stagnant, "I swing this way, you block/dodge,you swing this way, I block/dodge,I swing this way, you block/dodge..."
But you need to temper yourself, any auto hit should be smart and probably consist of two posts, (One setting up the hit, and the other being the hit) Use a ploy or two, distract them, anything smart really. If they complain, ask them what they would have done to counter it. If you did good enough, then they won't be able to answer.

But it should only be used as a last resort mind you.

 

[Asemir]

Though I respect what a lot of the fol here had to say, it begs the question that if everyone always operated like that, then almost all PVP could be described in one word, "miss."

Respectfully disagree. Knowing when to take hits is a key component of trusting and respecting the opposing writer. If I'm writing against Ashin/Jon, I trust that he will accept a hit if it is a logical and well written attack. I trust that he's not going to magically Force-magic-deus ex machina his way out of an impossible situation and call the punch a miss. On the other hand, Jon also trusts and respects me enough that I'm not going to blatantly force his character into no-win situations. He also trusts that I'm not going to just auto-kill his character, and that trust enables him to allow his character to take hits (and possibly even lose).

That said, I do agree that auto-hits are necessary. However, it's the degree of the auto-hit that must be determined by the target. And this is also where trust/respect comes in. I trust that Jon is going to allow me leeway to auto-hit his character. He trusts me that I won't write the auto-hit as insta-killing or insta-crippling. I trust that he'll accept the auto-hit and consequences.

The key problem with PvP writing is that everyone has the mindset that they must win. There's no way that they'll let their character lose, and that contributes to the auto-miss syndrome. It's really ego, not trust/respect, that is the fundamental problem of auto-miss. If people trusted/respected one another, then they would set aside their egos for the sake of the story.

(As an aside, PvP writing-RP doesn't even make sense because there's no objective rules. It's like playground kids playing Cowboys and Indians, and then arguing who shot whom. "I shot you!" "No you didn't!" PvP only works if it's part of a larger story. Story-focus, that's what it's got to be. But I digress.)

 

[Mel'sivlal Huedain]

[member="Asemir Lor'kora"]

That's the thing, "Trust." If you get into a battle in an invasion pvp instance or Dominion pvp instance chances are that you won't know everyone on the other side, and its hard and unfair on players you don't know to avoid them and fight someone you know.

 

[Asemir]

[member="Asemir Lor'kora"]

That's the thing, "Trust." If you get into a battle in an invasion pvp instance or Dominion pvp instance chances are that you won't know everyone on the other side, and its hard and unfair on players you don't know to avoid them and fight someone you know.

Agreed and good point. For those situations, I submit that people should just act as adults and to not take this place seriously. Again, ego and/or respect. If your Jedi knight character is fighting a Sith lord, please graciously accept the hits and so forth. On the other hand, the Sith lord writer should not be maiming and insta-killing the Jedi knight.

 

[Minna]

"I swing this way, you block/dodge,you swing this way, I block/dodge,I swing this way, you block/dodge..."

Couldn't help but think of:

But like other's said, it depends on the writer and how well you know them. Personally I'm fine with taking hits, to be honest I enjoy my character being beaten up as much as I enjoy beating up someone else's. In an ideal world it's all about an enjoyable joint story, although sometimes that's hard to achieve while keeping everyone happy.

 

[Orick T'ane]

(As an aside, PvP writing-RP doesn't even make sense because there's no objective rules. It's like playground kids playing Cowboys and Indians, and then arguing who shot whom. "I shot you!" "No you didn't!" PvP only works if it's part of a larger story. Story-focus, that's what it's got to be. But I digress.)

I blame consoles for cramming bad FTS games down our throats. Other than that, everything you've said is spot on.

I will agree with [member="Mel'sivlal Huedain"] on the trust thing. The only solution to that is time. You have to earn trust, especially if you're new. It's sometimes not fair but you're the new kid on the block and you have to put in the work to become a part of the group. On the flip side, the group has to be open and welcoming. Don't be afraid to PM people and discuss things though, get a feel for the person as you're writing with them, explain the things you don't want to happen to your character, like death. Mostly everyone will be accommodating, and they all want to tell cool stories with their hero too.

 

[Arumi Zy]

[member="Darth Valdra"] You try to grapple me i will lazer sword you bro!

Nah, if your going to be doing that kind of thing it be best to find someone who doesn't mind writing against that kind of thing. If you pm'd me wanting a good old fashioned brawl i would go a long with it. You came charging me like a bear cat out of hell with your arms up i am going to just side step you and burn out a hole in your britches. It all comes down to two writers respecting each other and communicating, Expecially when they have tha supah force powah sayain 100876997 on their sides.

 

[Edward Vyperion]

Expecially when they have tha supah force powah sayain 100876997 on their sides.

Yup, I know this much because one lightsaber could reduce me to just my songsteel and desh body, and they don't even need the force to harm me with one, but they'll go extreme on yer ass in seconds.

 

[H3xle]

My two cents for this discussion is that auto-hits are never ok. If your opponent is constantly doing the dodge and attack without taking hits, look into their bio to see what it says and then talk to them. If, after talking to them, the issue is not resolved, go up the chain and talk to either an FA (If in a Dom/Invasion/Faction Thread) and if that fails, go to an RPJ, their time is precious and they deserve fun as well, but they are here to help with disputes.

Also, not everyone on this site has martial arts experience (though it seems that a majority will at least claim it, it is the internet and we may never truly know) so saying "Trust me, when you do this, I get to do this to you" is not something that I, personally, will tolerate. If someone decides that they auto hit me, I am going to go through the steps I lined out above. If the same person does it more than once, I'll simply not write with that person until the problem is resolved.

This site is about having fun, character's losing and character's dying are things that sometimes happen. If you lose, use it as an in story impetus to get better. If you die, and can't use it as an in story impetus to get better (o.0), then go on with a different character. Mind you, character death is only ok with permission, so yeah.

 

[Edward Vyperion]

[member="Dair Cotarin"]

The dodge thing is annoying, even I can say that. I'd take a hit or two, but not if I dunno how to respond to said hit though tbh

 

[H3xle]

I like to err on the side of getting hit more often. Mixing up dodging and resilience when appropriate. Getting hit once, twice or even a dozen times doesn't mean you have lost.

The important thing is to talk to your opponent and make a good, enjoyable story.

 

[Arumi Zy]

[member="Dair Cotarin"] Ehh if you get hit with a light saber you might as well say you lost... that limb..

Taking hits is a good thing depending on what you get hit with, i wouldn't take a saber hit lightly for the sake of erring on the side of caution but a blade, fist, pommel, boot, possibly a blaster can all be dealt with. In the movies a bare nick with the saber will drop ya.