Star Wars Roleplay: Chaos

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My Ep VII Thoughts & Questions

Ok. I literally needed an entire weekend to calm down from the high this movie gave me. So, yes, obviously I enjoyed it. I'm not gonna do a "Review" really, just going to say the few things I really liked, and a couple of questions I thought I would ask, to get some feedback as to what other people might have thought.

First. Again, I love BB-8. He was easily, hands down, my favorite character in the film. Yep. A droid. Was my favorite new character. From the very moment he appears on the screen, to every single scene he is in, he's both adorable, and well utilized as a character. He makes you believe he has a true personality, like Artoo. When he tries to wake up R2, and is saddened by his refusal, you feel sad for him, or, at least I did. When he finally awakens, and they are together, it felt like magic. The two sync and are incredible together. I truly hope there is more of the dynamic between BB-8 and R2 in the future films. I could go on and on about these two droids, because quite frankly, aside from Ahsoka, they're my favorite SW characters.

Now, moving on. I was ecstatic to see Han and Chewie again. To me, it felt simply amazing to see them back aboard the MF. They interacted really well with the new characters. I have to admit I am incredibly sad that I won't be able to see more of a dynamic between Han & Rey later. I felt like they had a lot of potential to build on the brief periods they spent together.

The super weapon. The comparison between it and the Death Star...

Question #1. How in the world did nobody know about this thing being built? It's 3x, if not more, the size of the Death Star, and that thing was comparable to a MOON. This would be like a full scale planet, if not larger. So, on the edges of space, this monstrosity was constructed, and nobody ever knew? Well then...Okay. I can forgive this, as I don't really see it as damaging to the film, just something I found to be a little strange.

Question #2. Why bother even mentioning the Republic, really? Aside from establishing that it was in fact, rebuilt, or in the process of rebuilding. But there was really no reason to state that The First Order just destroyed the New Republic (Is the Republic really only three planets at this point?). They could have just blown up three random planets to demonstrate its' power. There was no other mention of the Republic outside of its' stated funding of the Resistance for the audience to care about. The Republic was just a name, really. Nobody had any real need to care right now. So my question here is two part. Why bother mentioning the Republic? And why blow up three planets of the Republic instead of simply blowing up three other planets.

Moving on...The lightsaber fights. You either hated them, or loved them. There doesn't seem to be many in between folks. I personally loved the fights. They were raw and intense. Here's my take on the Kylo VS Finn VS Rey. Kylo was shot already, and they very clearly wanted you to focus on his injury, given that they made it a point to show you blood drip from him in the snow, and him grasping at his wound. Kylo also was not a Jedi Knight when he abandoned the Order, at least I don't believe so. When Snoke trained him, he was an apprentice. He could be a "Sith Knight" as far as title goes, but he's certainly no Sith Lord (I understand that they're not actually Sith). He has little control over his emotions, and even explains being "tempted by the light" which I found to be an AMAZING line of dialog. It shows he was conflicted between his feelings, and gave a lot more depth to the dark side than ever before.

So, getting back to the lightsaber fights. I don't believe you need "training" to simply wield a lightsaber. Luke didn't cut his hand off the first time he ignited his father's saber, and twirled it around a few times. I feel like to be effective with a saber, on a scale comparable to what would classify a Jedi Knight as, you would require training. To simply pick it up, and slash at people with it, like any ordinary sword, it could most certainly be done. Aside from that, judging by the Stormtrooper that wielded his own saber resistant weapon, Finn had similar training, enough to know which end to slash at, and swing it like a sword or a bat. He lost pretty spectacularly against Kylo. When it came to Rey, she was very clearly proficient with a staff, and so was able to transfer those skills quite well when it came to fighting Kylo, who was, again, already very well injured, and probably getting tired, having also just fought Finn's rather heavy handed swings. He took a couple of hits before falling, himself. He also wanted to convert her to his cause. He knew she was Force sensitive, and even Snoke wanted her. So he was also trying not to kill her.

Question #3: With regard to Kylo taking saber strikes: Was his armor saber resistant? I am leaning toward this. Or were Rey's slashes only grazes? I feel like she was pretty close, but the armor seemed resistant. I would have to rewatch to really form this opinion.

Ben Solo: He looks emo. I agree here. He is far more menacing with his mask on. It's the hair, really. Had his hair been shaved, or just a lot shorter, he would have been fine, so I can't really harp on this too much. He is still a great villain, and I am happy to see more of him later.

Question #4: How the hell did he get Vader's mask? I wish this was explained, even briefly. I suppose one could surmise the mask wasn't burned to ash, and he stumbled upon Vader's funeral pyre, but that seems like a strange hand waive.

Han's death: It pissed me off. I understand why they did it. They needed someone important to die, and to give way to accepting the new character's and their roles. I get it. But that doesn't stop me from being angry about it. Han & Chewie. It's just a thing. I don't think I'll ever really accept Rey & Chewie as a thing, if that is to become of their relationship.

Luke's 0 lines: I wish, I really, really wish he said something at the end. Anything he said would have been an instant quote. Standing there, with Rey holding out his saber, looking at her. It was just an awkward staring contest for 30 seconds. This was really my biggest disappointment with the movie. I simply wish Luke had said one line, right then.

Side note: People clapping in the theater...I've always wondered this. Who are you clapping for? Nobody from Disney is there to receive your applause. You're clapping for the guy running the reel in the back room above you. haha. I hope he's up there taking a bow for your applause. I'm ignorant, I know. I just find this funny, personally.

Final note: Storm troopers finally learned they have scopes/sights on their blasters. I'm impressed.

PS: BB-8 is still my favorite new character.
 
Seraphina Shel'tah said:
But there was really no reason to state that The First Order just destroyed the New Republic (Is the Republic really only three planets at this point?). They could have just blown up three random planets to demonstrate its' power. There was no other mention of the Republic outside of its' stated funding of the Resistance for the audience to care about. The Republic was just a name, really. Nobody had any real need to care right now. So my question here is two part. Why bother mentioning the Republic? And why blow up three planets of the Republic instead of simply blowing up three other planets.
The First Order targeted the Hosnian system because Hosnian Prime was the current capital of the New Republic, and also housed the entire senate and a large portion of the Republic's fleet that hadn't been decommissioned by the Military Disarmament Act. Instead of a stationary capital like the Old Republic had (Coruscant), the New Republic periodically rotates its capital within its member worlds. Like when the New Republic was first formed after the Battle of Endor the capital was Chandrilla which was Mon Mothma's homeworld, and she was the first Chancellor of the New Republic.

Basically what the First Order did is like if the One Sith had the same weapon and targeted Chazwa, the Republic's current capital, and destroyed it. Their capital would be kaput, but they'd still have all of that territory left.

Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Question #1. How in the world did nobody know about this thing being built? It's 3x, if not more, the size of the Death Star, and that thing was comparable to a MOON. This would be like a full scale planet, if not larger. So, on the edges of space, this monstrosity was constructed, and nobody ever knew? Well then...Okay. I can forgive this, as I don't really see it as damaging to the film, just something I found to be a little strange.
Going back to this question. The Chancellor by the time of TFA, Lanever Villecham, did not consider the First Order to be any major threat to the New Republic, hence why he only secretly funded Leia's Resistance movement instead of doing something more militaristic about it. It's also most likely the reason why Starkiller Base was able to be constructed in secret for who knows how many years, and the only time anyone actually found out about it is when it destroyed the New Republic's capital.

[member="Seraphina Shel'tah"]
 

Switch

Don't make me bite you...
Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Question #1. How in the world did nobody know about this thing being built? It's 3x, if not more, the size of the Death Star, and that thing was comparable to a MOON. This would be like a full scale planet, if not larger. So, on the edges of space, this monstrosity was constructed, and nobody ever knew? Well then...Okay. I can forgive this, as I don't really see it as damaging to the film, just something I found to be a little strange.

I thought that was a little odd, myself. I can understand people not knowing about it's construction, but there is no way they could keep the testing period a secret, as stars and planets would be vanishing from the galaxy.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Question #2. Why bother even mentioning the Republic, really? Aside from establishing that it was in fact, rebuilt, or in the process of rebuilding. But there was really no reason to state that The First Order just destroyed the New Republic (Is the Republic really only three planets at this point?). They could have just blown up three random planets to demonstrate its' power. There was no other mention of the Republic outside of its' stated funding of the Resistance for the audience to care about. The Republic was just a name, really. Nobody had any real need to care right now. So my question here is two part. Why bother mentioning the Republic? And why blow up three planets of the Republic instead of simply blowing up three other planets.


I thought this was a ham-fisted attempt to establish the might of the First Order, as well as set the stage for a galaxy without the republic. I personally think it would have been a bit less heavy handed if they had just started the movie shortly after the Republic was destroyed. This could have been what spurred the Resistance to seek out Luke once again, or something like that.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Question #3: With regard to Kylo taking saber strikes: Was his armor saber resistant? I am leaning toward this. Or were Rey's slashes only grazes? I feel like she was pretty close, but the armor seemed resistant. I would have to rewatch to really form this opinion.

You could safely assume that she wasn't trying to kill him, but I'd find it more interesting if his armor was somehow resistant to sabers. We know the tech exists to some degree in the universe.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Han's death: It pissed me off. I understand why they did it. They needed someone important to die, and to give way to accepting the new character's and their roles. I get it. But that doesn't stop me from being angry about it. Han & Chewie. It's just a thing. I don't think I'll ever really accept Rey & Chewie as a thing, if that is to become of their relationship.


The unfortunate truth is that Harrison Ford wanted Han to die decades ago, and now they found a way to turn him into the Sacrificial Lion. They used his death to show that that kernel of light nestled inside of Ben wasn't quite enough to beat away Kylo Ren. Not yet, anyway. I think they could have handled the whole affair better, but it's one of the things I was utterly unsurprising about. It could have been worse.

Regarding Rey and Chewie, I feel like Rey bonded with the duo extremely quickly. I think it was a result of the Han situation, to be honest.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Side note: People clapping in the theater...I've always wondered this. Who are you clapping for? Nobody from Disney is there to receive your applause. You're clapping for the guy running the reel in the back room above you. haha. I hope he's up there taking a bow for your applause. I'm ignorant, I know. I just find this funny, personally.


I got hit in the back of the head by a toy lightsaber during the last fight, people be crazy.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Final note: Storm troopers finally learned they have scopes/sights on their blasters. I'm impressed.

It's hard to shoot an interesting and drawn out gunfight, but they did a lot better this time. The Storm Troopers actually killed people! Huzzah!

Final note: BB-8 officially won me over with the "thumbs up" he shared with Finn. Love him to bits. XD

[member="Seraphina Shel'tah"]
 
Switch said:
I can understand people not knowing about it's construction, but there is no way they could keep the testing period a secret, as stars and planets would be vanishing from the galaxy.
Starkiller Base was in the Unknown Regions, a region of the galaxy still vastly unexplored.

I don't think a lot of people would notice planets and stars disappearing if they're not properly charted in the first place.

[member="Switch "]
 

Pyro

Guest
P
Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Han's death: It pissed me off.
Me too. *bursts into tears again*


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Again, I love BB-8. He was easily, hands down, my favorite character in the film. Yep. A droid. Was my favorite new character. From the very moment he appears on the screen, to every single scene he is in, he's both adorable, and well utilized as a character. He makes you believe he has a true personality, like Artoo. When he tries to wake up R2, and is saddened by his refusal, you feel sad for him, or, at least I did. When he finally awakens, and they are together, it felt like magic. The two sync and are incredible together. I truly hope there is more of the dynamic between BB-8 and R2 in the future films. I could go on and on about these two droids, because quite frankly, aside from Ahsoka, they're my favorite SW characters.
We are so alike!!!! DROIDS FOREVER!
 
They specifically pointed out how powerful the bow caster was, like three times. Because Kylo took a shot from it, I can only assume his armor is pretty fierce. But the fact that he took that shot and continued to fight goes to prove that he's far more capable than what he is given credit for.

I just think that JJ was trying to push home the idea that the sabers can be wielded in more ways than the standard one shot ending to a battle. That getting hit by a saber doesn't mean you are out for the match.
 
The Revenant said:
They specifically pointed out how powerful the bow caster was, like three times. Because Kylo took a shot from it, I can only assume his armor is pretty fierce. But the fact that he took that shot and continued to fight goes to prove that he's far more capable than what he is given credit for.

I just think that JJ was trying to push home the idea that the sabers can be wielded in more ways than the standard one shot ending to a battle. That getting hit by a saber doesn't mean you are out for the match.
YESSSSSS my gosh the bowcaster is AWESOME. I loved that Han asked to borrow it and was clearly impressed by its' incredible power.
 

Connor Harrison

Guest
C
[member="Seraphina Shel'tah"] Loved your thoughts and questions! I'm going to come back to this to give my view on them tomorrow when I have more time. Great thoughts you put forward however. I'll be seeing it again on the 22nd....tomorrow! :D
 
I loved the silence at the end. I'm so glad they kept Luke word-less, because that one glance between Luke and Rey spoke a thousand words. It spoke of Luke's uncertainty at what he is now expected to do: does he accept the lightsaber and return to his sister, to the possibility of the Jedi's return, despite knowing that - or thinking that - he had failed his family, his Code, after Ben fell and he simply fled rather than facing up to it.

I think honestly it was the perfect ending.

(Switched to a less known alt, this is just an opinion and nothing more :) )
 
Seraphina Shel'tah said:
The super weapon. The comparison between it and the Death Star...

Question #1. How in the world did nobody know about this thing being built? It's 3x, if not more, the size of the Death Star, and that thing was comparable to a MOON. This would be like a full scale planet, if not larger. So, on the edges of space, this monstrosity was constructed, and nobody ever knew? Well then...Okay. I can forgive this, as I don't really see it as damaging to the film, just something I found to be a little strange.

Question #2. Why bother even mentioning the Republic, really? Aside from establishing that it was in fact, rebuilt, or in the process of rebuilding. But there was really no reason to state that The First Order just destroyed the New Republic (Is the Republic really only three planets at this point?). They could have just blown up three random planets to demonstrate its' power. There was no other mention of the Republic outside of its' stated funding of the Resistance for the audience to care about. The Republic was just a name, really. Nobody had any real need to care right now. So my question here is two part. Why bother mentioning the Republic? And why blow up three planets of the Republic instead of simply blowing up three other planets.
I also thought the super-weapon part was very like, what? Mainly because of the strong World War 2 Nazi overtones of that scene where the weapon is fired with the little fascist ginger and his stormtroopers standing triumphantly near that big red banner. I agree that mentioning the Republic at all felt unnecessary, unless it's meant to underscore some sort of symbolic metaphor of The First Order as fascists and the Republic as... a republic. Really the significance of the destruction of those planets was practically totally lost on me because of how little a role the Republic plays in the film.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Ben Solo: He looks emo. I agree here. He is far more menacing with his mask on. It's the hair, really. Had his hair been shaved, or just a lot shorter, he would have been fine, so I can't really harp on this too much. He is still a great villain, and I am happy to see more of him later.
I agree that his look was not what I expected, and almost made me laugh a little, but in the drama of that scene I think he managed to assert himself as a serious character. Did anyone else recognize him as the character Adam from Girls? I was mostly just glad for him for getting cast in such a major role when that's the only other thing I've seen him in!
 
Seraphina Shel'tah said:
How in the world did nobody know about this thing being built? It's 3x, if not more, the size of the Death Star, and that thing was comparable to a MOON. This would be like a full scale planet, if not larger. So, on the edges of space, this monstrosity was constructed, and nobody ever knew? Well then...Okay. I can forgive this, as I don't really see it as damaging to the film, just something I found to be a little strange.

Alright, so here is the important thing. It was built out of a planet. So instead of being built near some industrial planet or something, it was being built literally into a planet. Also, the galaxy is HUGE. At SWRP it is easy to get caught up in the immediacy of things and how small the galaxy feels, but the galaxy is huge. If Russians can hide the development of certain weapons and test them out, when we've got satallites going around the planet looking for things. Imagine how much could go missing in the a galaxy when you're not actually looking at anything. As far as stars going out during testing, light takes a long time to get to places. Like light is super fast, but just because a star is gone does not mean that you'd know it quickly. Assuming this is done on the edge of the galaxy, it would take YEARS upon YEARS for it to vanish from the sky, and that's (once again) assuming anyone is even looking for it.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Why bother even mentioning the Republic, really? Aside from establishing that it was in fact, rebuilt, or in the process of rebuilding. But there was really no reason to state that The First Order just destroyed the New Republic (Is the Republic really only three planets at this point?). They could have just blown up three random planets to demonstrate its' power. There was no other mention of the Republic outside of its' stated funding of the Resistance for the audience to care about. The Republic was just a name, really. Nobody had any real need to care right now. So my question here is two part. Why bother mentioning the Republic? And why blow up three planets of the Republic instead of simply blowing up three other planets.
Few reasons. The first is the importance of showing that the Republic was even made. The Rebellion succeeded in reestablishing that which they were trying to do. It also in a few lines explains the resistance being funded by them, but that the Republic is not dedicating their full power to take on the First Order. And the planets destroyed were important because they're meant to put the Resistance in an even worse situation. They're already small and fighting the First Order, who is by comparison not as large as the Republic so if they ever took it seriously maybe the First Order wouldn't be able to fight back. However, The First Order took out 1) the Republic's senate and therefore its leadership sending it into disarray 2) cuts of the Resistance's support which means they're going to be in a bad place for awhile and 3) destroyed the fleet which could threaten them.

So the inclusion of the Republic is actually very important.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
With regard to Kylo taking saber strikes: Was his armor saber resistant? I am leaning toward this. Or were Rey's slashes only grazes? I feel like she was pretty close, but the armor seemed resistant. I would have to rewatch to really form this opinion.
Honestly no idea. I think he seemed to grimace when hit. So I think it hurt somewhat. It is a shame that the gravity of being hit with a lightsaber was somewhat lessened (Obi Wan was on the ground reeling with pain from two cuts). Maybe it lessened the degree to which he was burned. Idk.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
Ben Solo: He looks emo. I agree here. He is far more menacing with his mask on. It's the hair, really. Had his hair been shaved, or just a lot shorter, he would have been fine, so I can't really harp on this too much. He is still a great villain, and I am happy to see more of him later.
I honestly thought he looked fine. I get why people say he looked emo, but to me he looked human. I think it intentionally showed that behind the Mask he's just another person. It humanized him. He's just another scared, insecure human.


Seraphina Shel'tah said:
How the hell did he get Vader's mask? I wish this was explained, even briefly. I suppose one could surmise the mask wasn't burned to ash, and he stumbled upon Vader's funeral pyre, but that seems like a strange hand waive.

He went and found it lol. I mean that's the best I have cause it is the only answer needed lol.


Mysa Snowstrider said:
I loved the silence at the end. I'm so glad they kept Luke word-less, because that one glance between Luke and Rey spoke a thousand words. It spoke of Luke's uncertainty at what he is now expected to do: does he accept the lightsaber and return to his sister, to the possibility of the Jedi's return, despite knowing that - or thinking that - he had failed his family, his Code, after Ben fell and he simply fled rather than facing up to it. I think honestly it was the perfect ending.
I agree with this standpoint.
 
Selena Halcyon said:
Few reasons. The first is the importance of showing that the Republic was even made. The Rebellion succeeded in reestablishing that which they were trying to do. It also in a few lines explains the resistance being funded by them
Everything you said was entirely established in the opening crawl. That's why I didn't see any further purpose of it. The scene did nothing to make me care any further about the existence of the Republic or its' re-destruction. Just felt kind of like they wanted us to care about the Republic, and be horrified by its' destruction once again. To me, it was just "Oh, the weapon can blow up three planets at once, it's Death Star 3.0. Cool. Moving on." To me it just didn't feel like it drove home the emotional point it was trying to connect.
 

Connor Harrison

Guest
C
Question #1. How in the world did nobody know about this thing being built? It's 3x, if not more, the size of the Death Star, and that thing was comparable to a MOON. This would be like a full scale planet, if not larger. So, on the edges of space, this monstrosity was constructed, and nobody ever knew? Well then...Okay. I can forgive this, as I don't really see it as damaging to the film, just something I found to be a little strange.
I guess it is one of those things where we never know, but on the edge of space, tucked away, who knows if anyone would have noticed. The fact is was built into a planet makes it tricky as the planet would already be there so they’d work around that to keep it as hidden as possible...I think, I may be wrong.



Question #2. Why bother even mentioning the Republic, really? Aside from establishing that it was in fact, rebuilt, or in the process of rebuilding. But there was really no reason to state that The First Order just destroyed the New Republic (Is the Republic really only three planets at this point?). They could have just blown up three random planets to demonstrate its' power. There was no other mention of the Republic outside of its' stated funding of the Resistance for the audience to care about. The Republic was just a name, really. Nobody had any real need to care right now. So my question here is two part. Why bother mentioning the Republic? And why blow up three planets of the Republic instead of simply blowing up three other planets.
I feel this is simply to keep the tendrils of the Republic active a little longer, showing and understanding how they’ve been active for so long but now being wiped out by a force more greater than them. Destroying the Republic shows the newly established might of the First Order, much like we heard the Emperor had “dissolved” the Senate in EpIV…the Empire was now in control. The First Order have just done the same, and it’s up to the Resistance to fight back.



Question #3: With regard to Kylo taking saber strikes: Was his armor saber resistant? I am leaning toward this. Or were Rey's slashes only grazes? I feel like she was pretty close, but the armor seemed resistant. I would have to rewatch to really form this opinion.
I bet the slashes he had were lucky grazes. As he got one to the face that luckily was a graze made easier due to him trying to avoid her attacks once she channels the Force. Was she a better swordsman and more in-tune with the Force she could have done more damage.


Question #4: How the hell did he get Vader's mask? I wish this was explained, even briefly. I suppose one could surmise the mask wasn't burned to ash, and he stumbled upon Vader's funeral pyre, but that seems like a strange hand waive.
Again, much speculation. I heard at one point the scene in the rain we glimpsed in the trailers which was Rey’s vision was actually a flashback to Endor and the Knights were killing Ewoks and Resistance forces to purge the last known location of Vader’s pyre and get the helmet.
But I can only assume Luke left the pyre to burn away, but Ben learnt of it in his youth and went to find it. Or he stole it from Luke if he took it for some reason…it’s a good question honestly, and hopefully we may get more of this Vader obsession in Ep VIII.

And re: Han getting killed, I bet it was part of Ford’s request. He was SO active promoting this film, I bet he did it on the basis this was his last time so he went all out to do what he could. A sad choice, but he wanted to die in ‘ROTJ’ for some emotional impact on the story – he gets his wish today I feel as he may have struggled over the next 4 years keeping Han’s energy and pace up along with what is expected of him.
 
I like that people actually think the Republic is 100% destroyed just cause it's capital was blown up.

EDIT: that screen in the rain was the Knights of Ren after they had slaughtered Luke's fledgling Jedi Order, prompting him to go into exile.

[member="Connor Harrison"]
 

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