The Difference Between IC, OOC, and doing away with crying "Meta".

[Thessa Kai]

The idea is to stop caring about people meta-gaming. If everyone would just moderate themselves and ignore the people who do stupid things (and tell them why you're ignoring them before doing so), people would learn rather quickly what's cool and what isn't.

Staff can't force people to role-play together. That's a consequence you can impose on others for doing things you don't think is cool. I don't understand why this isn't a thing.

Agreed on so many levels.

This probably doesn't pertain to the comment above but my mind went here after what Ayden wrote and some other things happened this month - I prefer to write things organically with as little planning as possible. Yes, sometimes planning is necessary. But other times it takes the fun out of the spirit of roleplaying. Shoot, if you want rping to be like life, you can't plan errrr thing. It's not like people get a heads up about falling in love or some other tragedy like that.

 

[Kei Amadis]

@[member="Ire'Rain Sekairo"] Exactly roll with it best you can, and see where it takes you. That was the main thing I agreed with in the first post.

There are always the angles of IC playing up the other person as delusional if they do something, or just countering like with like (to an extent), saying for example: Despite what he thought he saw, there was an explosion, a ball of flame but most of the ship held together, it'd take more than one hit to break it apart.

In an invasion you can always go to a different part of the battlefield, and let them know OOC not to follow please. It isn't ideal I grant you.

When it comes to interacting with something you think silly, just play it that way but IC. Example when Kei tried to swing an imperial trooper to his point of view, I guessed it was going to get shot down, that was the point to encourage someone too shoot it down. Even played that angle up in the post, just to spur interest.

OOC/IC Some of my characters are so far removed from me, they are characters that have either evolved over years or taken pieces from other characters i've written to test out concepts and put them together. A couple share a few traits, but not that many. That is my split of IC/OOC, and also the fact that I am happy to have them lose, win, die, love, hug, cry. Rolling with whatever happens to them, whether its planned or not.

Though I will say you can have epic threads when you plan out a basic premise, and then just see what happens in that premise. Why? Because everyone feels engaged to write it out, engage two sides and you'll get two sides participating, like Valen for example.

 

[Nyxie]

It seems like invasions force people to "roleplay with these people we're sending to your planet or lose the planet," so actually, yeah, you kind of can force people to roleplay together. I can't ignore people acting like twits in invasions, especially if I'm the defender. Some situations are going to force problems, like it or not.

I feel like this point has been passive-aggressively dismissed/evaded.

What if you are up against a couple of people you don't particularly find savvy or who you think meta/et-c? You bow down and avoid them OOCly while they are thus given the IC freedom to lay siege? You tell their allies that they basically don't count to crap because something-or-other problem?

Just from a personal perspective, I think it would ball down to a matter of the two parties negotiating whether or not certain encounters (or lack thereof) can truly be counted towards victory/defeat upon the discussion of terms at the end of the thread, based on said circumstances. That is how I would handle it if it were I or another member of my faction. It would be nice to have had official backing/say on questions like this, however. Some people don't take it to heart until things are written in stone. :/

 

[Tefka]

There's lots of factors that go into judging an invasion's victory. Being a total tool to people isn't one of them.

With that said, I will draft a guide soon on how invasions should be judged.

 

[Kei Amadis]

@[member="Alachei Mnemenos"] yeah its not about what counts and what doesn't. Just about having fun with the thread, I would rp it out with them, the best I was able, but I can fully understand OOC or IC if someone or a character, doesn't find it fun or fitting. So that option is always there to take part in an invasion elsewhere on the field, or in space for example.

Awesome Tef!

 

[Jsc]

You bow down and avoid them OOCly while they are thus given the IC freedom to lay siege?

Bowing out is a good idea. It's polite, courteous, and acknowledges that all IC gains on this website are fictional. Having no real weight. The Map was invented to create dramatic tension amongst characters and factions; and to spawn exciting stories and writing opportunities. Not to provide any writer, or group of writers, with simulated victory. When a faction takes to the board their goal is not to win. It is to participate in creating a fun and dramatic writing environment.

Sadly, many factions forget this. So we forgive them, remind them, and move on with why we are here. To kick butt and chew bubble-gum! *wink*

 

[Nikolas Faselli]

What? It's not about winning? Dang it! Then my whole life has been a lie...

 

[Ayden Cater]

For me, one of the biggest problems that comes up stems from consequence. Everyone loves it when their character "wins"; when some action they take is successful and they get away with whatever it was they were aiming to get done. Conversely, a lot of folks seem to get extremely sullen, if not out-right angry, when things go against them. Suddenly it becomes about "metagaming" and "OOC issues being taken IC". If someone yields to you, it's them acquiescing to your superiority. If they stand against you, they're being rude and metagaming.

At a certain point, you have to learn to accept the bad with the good; things can't always play out for us like Episode IV. Sometimes, we get stuck with Episode V (Or III if you're really bad). Sometimes bad things happen to our characters and we should all accept that. Ayden's had his victories and his defeats, and each of those moments is as fun and memorable for me as the other. Sure, I might not have been willing to sing songs while some of them were going on, but I'm looking back at it all and I'm happy with it.

 

[Nyxie]

It's polite, courteous, and acknowledges that all IC gains on this website are fictional. Having no real weight. The Map was invented to create dramatic tension amongst characters and factions; and to spawn exciting stories and writing opportunities. Not to provide any writer, or group of writers, with simulated victory.

That's a great view and I agree with it wholeheartedly,
But tell that to the guy kicking the door to your capital in.

(Then again, four fifths of the major factions are too big to have to worry about ever having their core broken down anyway)

 

[Jsc]

But tell that to the guy kicking the door to your capital in.

Hopefully we do. Via PM and pleasant conversation. There is nothing wrong with talking to your IC opponents writer. I would encourage it. Communication is key. Especially during chaotic threads that involve personal combat between characters.

On another website, my personal favorite IC opponents stemmed from the beautiful relationships I held with their OOC writers. They respected me and I respected them. Winning and losing meant nothing to us. Not because our emotional investment in our characters wasn't firm and strong. But because we valued the experience of writing and storytelling much higher. Our emotional investment in being OOC friends, overcame our desire to win IC. Team sport.

Now I respect all my IC opponents. They teach me were I am strong. They teach me were I am weak.
Now I respect all my OOC opponents. They teach me how to forgive. They become my greatest friends.

 

[Ayden Cater]

@[member="Jay Scott Clark"]
Well spoken. I couldn't agree more.

 

[Onrai]

No. You can't be forced to roleplay with someone. You tell them you don't wanna roleplay with them and then you alert an RPJ if they continue to pursue/harass.

I do have to disagree here, Tef. Following the previous point @Mr. Ash made, Invasions have a habit of forcing such an issue. If someone you don't want to RP with attacks what you're defending in an invasion, you kind of have to respond to their actions whether you want to or not. Otherwise you're simply holding part of the thread up. It's likely that to put pressure on the person to RP, the person attacking(that they didn't want to RP with) would gain the objective due to a lack of resistance from the defender.

And of course there's the whole jumping into a random thread and attacking with a character, who'll continue to persist in the event you choose to not acknowledge their post and continue RPing without them. Then if they do something to your character, they can claim "he/she never moved to defend against it."

Again, have personal experience from this sort of thing, and would be glad to give an example of such an incident.

 

[Ayden Cater]

You don't get to post in a thread like an Invasion and then say "I don't want to roleplay with any of the opposition." By participating in that thread, you are giving tacit agreement to roleplay with anyone on the opposition. That goes for any sort of public thread; if you post in it, you're signing yourself up for the unknown.

The board does not revolve around a single person. People take actions to further their goals and ambitions, the same as you or I would. At the same time, no one gets to kill your character until you say so, or if put in a situation that the RPJs rule was executed fairly and is unavoidable. Beyond that, it's just a part of the story.

 

[Nyxie]

I like how Jay put it, so to put it bluntly Circe; get someone else to rough 'em up if you don't feel like doing the deed or they're too volatile. It doesn't have to be your concern, and while I do support competitive playing (let's face it, RPG's are still games), no one should beat themselves up or drop to a such a level of discomfort in order to appease either their establishment or that of another.

As for the people being just total genitalia about OOC, well.... that's why there is a rule against unconscentual killing. Then again, you might get the "Vegetative state" threat like I almost did once -- not technically killing your character, right? Well, ignore it and humbly abscond from the thread. Not like they can force you to continue to thread with them, thus they can't force you to get vegetable'd. No one can force you.

Now, I'll admit that getting essentially forced out of a thread is pretty rude stuff if it was an intent to do so. That's why you find the people you like -- the people who like you -- and have friendly threads on mutual ground. In the event you should get bombarded again, at the very least, you won't be alone and be around those with an IC and OOC understanding.

I've come from genuine zoned-PvP sites. The ones where if you're killed, you're killed, and few places are safe. This is nothing in comparison. It's about the quality and the enjoyment, not winning or fighting to survive. So it shouldn't be taken to be. :3

@[member="Circe Savan"]

 

[Tefka]

Everyone's entitled to their own opinions, but there will never be a rule forcing people to ignore or not ignore other people. It's a power that should always remain in the player's hands.

So disagree all you want, but...

#tyrannyreigns

 

[Ayden Cater]

Welcome our short, green overlord, I do.

 

[Other Space Kaiden]

*pops out of a giant cake while sitting on his space toilet and reading the Sith section of the Newspaper*

o_q a very interesting read indeed. Metgaming is a tool that can be used for evil, but most the time it is just a device used so that people can make stories. I say just make the best of what you can, ignore people who try to do dumb things and have fun.