Why?

[Onrai]

Can someone please explain to me when and why we're having another invasion with the Mandalorians after we already did our fething best to stop this bullcrap from happening again? I'll be quite frank, I am pissed right now that we're gonna have to go through this nightmare yet again at their hands instead of being able to move on and get better as a faction.

 

[Persephone Callas]

Probably because one can not stop an invasion once the notice has been sent?

All you can do is negotiate terms then.

 

[Onrai]

Why did the notice get sent in the first place? We already got the picture - Mandos are stronger than us as a faction and can basically do whatever they please without us being able to do anything about it. I thought that once they took Roche, increasing our streak of invasion losses to 0-13, that we'd agreed to negotiate out some terms so this wouldn't happen again and we wouldn't have to end up getting horrifically humiliated by them once more.

That said, if this invasion was created due to the ridiculousness that is Alderaan having apparently seceded from the Republic, if the Mandalorians wanted to negotiate for the territory, they could've simply talked to our FAs and agreed to work something out instead of thrusting yet another invasion on us.

 

[Popo]

[member="Vitor Imperieuse"]
Iunno... Cause the IC plot makes sense? Because it's an IC invasion? Because the ooc doesn't matter, only the IC? If it wasn't for botched attempts at nationalism, seizing corporate assets, subsequently insulting an entire culture, and then committing war crimes that resulted in the direct death of the Jedi daughter of a major mandalorian clan leader/former Jedi Master.... Pretty sure they'd have stayed in their corner of the galaxy.

But that's just my opinion. For all I know, jet fuel does burn that hot.

 

[Khyros Sunblade]

[member="Popo"]

It makes sense only until you get to the point where we did settle peace with the Mandalorians. At this point, this does not make much IC sense outside of Clan Ordo and Clan Vereen. Clan Ordo from what I've read, doesn't care about actually taking Alderaan from the Republic, it just wants Alderaan safe. Vereen is a different story, and Draco has some fairly valid reasons, I will admit. Likewise, Alderaan has fairly valid reasons to want to secede.

However, this invasion will likely railroad the peace process into the dumpster. It will show the Republic, ICly, that the Mandalorians can't keep their word. Whether any other governments will give two hoots that the Mandalorians are offering peace with one hand and stabbing us with the other will remain to be seen.

*shrugs* The way I see it, this is a bad move for both the Mandalorians and the Republic.

 

[Jack Sparrow]

Can someone please remind me who within the Mandalorian faction we made peace with? I'd like to get their help stopping this invasion if possible, since we did just broker peace, and I am currently working rather hard at keeping Alderaan from leaving the Republic.

 

[Alexander Sannes]

Why not just broker this peace ICly in the thread... im so confused why everyone is assuming we have to go straight to a military action with all this... and this is coming from the person who signed up to fight on the Mando side on an Alt.

Guys... diplomacy is the best thing we have right now. Its too late to stop the invasion, so instead defuse it and try to find some way to make all this work without the cloud being split apart and we getting our shit removed from the map, again. And as an extra note, as [member="Popo"] mentioned which was probably a massive hint.

DO IT IC.

Now, back to your regularly scheduled programming.

 

[Keira Priest]

The reasons they want an invasion can be nicely summarized with all [member="Popo"] had to say. None of that is incorrect in the least. However, the logic behind this is still confusing to me, and not just because we brokered peace. In the treaty with the Mandalorians, the Republic declared we wouldn't interfere if a member world chose to secede. My biggest question is why, ICly, would we feel the need to get involved after that?

 

[Mantic Dorn]

This is how I think it is. Not that its super clear but enough for me.

I dont think any GR military has attacked Alderaan (that cant have happened without a proper senate decission).
This is about that the Noble houses simply think that the Mandalorians are better allies then the GR and asked for Mandalorian protection.

The Mandalorians rushed there, formed a blocade and may if GR goes hostile and decides to attack Alderaan and force them to stay with the commonwealth defend Alderaans right to freedom! Freedom!
This route is not likely to happen though so there are other options that may happen.

If the outcome of the diplo talks are that Alderaan is to become a Mandalorian world we got a loss for the GR and most likely a cloud break on our hands. If the outcome of the diplo talks are that Alderaan stays with the Republic the Mandos can choose to leave in which case the map stays as it is or they can simply ignore the diplo and attack the planet anyway. IC will tell.

The OOC concern is perhaps that how on earth we are to decide as Faction admins which side of the diplo talks has won after the two weeks period end. Hopefully it wil be super clear and everyone agrees and smiles, and drinks hot tea and so forth and so back.

Until that break point of the invasion when IC turns to OOC decissions (the 20th) will regardless be very fun and interesting to follow.

 

[Jack Sparrow]

Who on the Mando side agreed to peace? We need to contact that person and get them involved in this discussion.

 

[Keira Priest]

Ember Rekali agreed to a ceasefire in that thread I posted, which stretched to Clan Rekali as a whole, according to what was said in his post. I can't say for sure whether anyone else has.

[member="Jack Sparrow"]

 

[Hira Mitsae]

[member="Mantic Dorn"]

Mantic's version is the most accurate one. The Mandalorians are not invading Alderaan, Clan Vereen and its allies are there at the behest of Alderaan's royal house. The invasion, then, is all about trying to convince Alderaan to return to the Republic.

So there won't be any hostilities unless the Republic initiates them (or if the Organas decide to stick with the Republic and the Mandalorians refuse to leave, I guess).

 

[Keira Priest]

[member="Darell Irani"], my only issue there is that the treaty both parties agreed to states that the Republic won't interfere if any of its member worlds choose to secede. That makes it seem to me that we wouldn't have a reason or want to convince Alderaan to remain in the Republic, as we don't want to violate the treaty. Or maybe I'm looking at this all wrong.

 

[Onrai]

[member="Popo"]

The IC plot was that this situation was resolved and wouldn't be happening again. Yes, the OOC does matter, because without people agreeing to RP sensibly towards one another, there can be no RP.

If it wasn't for a storyline full of bull, people working for the opposite faction they're supposed to work for as allies, and the realization that the person who did such was an NPC who's already going to go through the judicial process and take the punishment for his actions at Roche, this entire storyline would never have started in the first place. That's not, of course, helped by people deliberately flaking from the Republic worse than the skin on the head of a man with dandruff at critical points.

Also, and I'm only gonna ask this once - please don't compare anything relating to RP to an incident where people actually legit lost their lives. It's a line I don't appreciate being crossed. The only thing we legitimately have to lose is the ability to enjoy RPing on this site.

 

[Alexander Sannes]

Lets just return to IC.... this OOC... whining will only further destroy the Republic's reputation...

 

[Popo]

this does not make much IC sense outside of Clan Ordo and Clan Vereen

Clan Betna has ties of marriage to Clan Ordo and are close friends with Clan Vereen, so Clan Betna will also be there. Other clans will come or go as they find ties to get involved or to sit back and watch, however they see fit.

As for peace treaties and ceasefires... Personally, outside of OOC talks, nothing has been done IC'ly that I've personally seen. Mandalorians are a people of action, not one of democracy and senates. From my personal opinion as a writer and nothing else, you guys took too long to get the ball rolling. Hell, when the Jedi Order tried and convicted Matsu Ike for a bunch of stuff, it took... what? A week IC'ly and a day or two OOC to figure out what to do?

[member="Vitor Imperieuse"]
Um... What? You just made no sense. I tried, trust me, and I'm used to working with patients with dysphasia. I'm not sure what you're trying to get at.

I did get the "please don't bring up national tragedies" bit, though. Sorry, my line of work deals with tragedies on a daily basis, both personal and otherwise, so my filter on that is a bit... jaded. As for the reference, it was less to reference a national tragedy that happened over a decade ago and more to reference the conspiracy theorist vibes I got from your posts.

But hey, I'm just the dude in the corner over here. Please, don't stop your train of thought on my account.

 

[Khyros Sunblade]

worse than the skin on the head of a man with dandruff at critical points.

*shudders*

Lets just return to IC.... this OOC... whining will only further destroy the Republic's reputation...

Where is the IC? Things are still being hammered out, no thread has been created for this as of yet because of that fact. This thread here, while started as a bit of a rant thread, is perfectly fine to have. If GR writers want to vent in the GR forums, and they maintain proper etiquette while doing so, why should they be stopped?

Are you insisting that no one else vents in the OOC while waiting for the IC to happen? People come here to unwind, if that means venting a bit, why stop them?

Clan Betna has ties of marriage to Clan Ordo and are close friends with Clan Vereen, so Clan Betna will also be there. Other clans will come or go as they find ties to get involved or to sit back and watch, however they see fit. As for peace treaties and ceasefires... Personally, outside of OOC talks, nothing has been done IC'ly that I've personally seen. Mandalorians are a people of action, not one of democracy and senates. From my personal opinion as a writer and nothing else, you guys took too long to get the ball rolling. Hell, when the Jedi Order tried and convicted Matsu Ike for a bunch of stuff, it took... what? A week IC'ly and a day or two OOC to figure out what to do?

I understand the point of clans helping out other clans, I honestly do, that isn't me real issue.

This is the thread where the peace treaty happened. It was proposed by Keira Ticon, acting on behalf of Chancellor Jack Sparrow, and was accepted by the Mandalorian War Master Ember Rekali.

That is why I take some issue with this, because peace was just settled between the Clans and the Republic.

And on the case of going to slowly, I call foul. RL trumps this place forwards and backwards. Mantic, our FO, was LOA, I am in an accelerated grad program, so my ability to post fluctuates widely. If courtesy to your fellow writer isn't important, then by all means go right on bulldozing stuff. People will eventually stop wanting to write with the Mandalorians because of it, and they will be right back in the situation they were in less than a year ago.

OOC matters, because we are all here to enjoy ourselves. If that means that it takes a little longer for a much smaller pool of writers to get something done, then accept that and move on.

 

[Onrai]

Guess I'll abridge it.

1: IC plot was that we'd made up.
2: Without good OOC relations, there's no way IC stuff can happen because people won't agree to RP with each other. Forcing people to RP with one another works out horribly.
3: The Genevieve storyline was bull and should never have been allowed to happen.
4: Some people on the Pub side during the invasion were stupid and did what the Mandos told them to do without thinking for themselves.
5: An NPC was the person who decompressed the hangar that killed Aaralyn.

There was also the 9/11 thing - thanks for not doing that again - though comparing my type to the speech of someone with brain damage isn't exactly nice either.

Not sure how I'm apparently sounding like a conspiracy theorist if I haven't provided a reason for why anyone would actively want to continue this storyline. My only complaints are that it was resolved, it shouldn't be continuing, and that the situation with Alderaan should not be resolved through an invasion regardless of whether it's dealt with IC or OOC. I'm sure the RPJs would be fine letting the territory be exchanged(if that's what's agreed upon) outside of an invasion.

 

[Popo]

This is the thread where the peace treaty happened.It was proposed by Keira Ticon, acting on behalf of Chancellor Jack Sparrow, and was accepted by the Mandalorian War Master Ember Rekali. That is why I take some issue with this, because peace was just settled between the Clans and the Republic.

I did not know that thread existed, so you do have a point I do believe. That said, Alderaan is not a military invasion. The peace treaty states that the Republic will not interfere with any desire to secede. Alderaan wishes to secede. The treaty does not state where that planet must go once they secede and since there are pre-existing ties to Mandalorian clans, and since the Alderaanian nobility no longer trusts the republic, they want Mandalorian protection. Since the treaty states that no interference from the republic is to occur and Alderaan wants to join the Mandos, then it's less an invasion and more...

It's equivalent to, say, a divorce. You and your significant other have issues, your significant other is finally done, and boots you out. They own the house, so you have to leave. Let's say your significant other doesn't trust you for some reason or is paranoid or outright crazy, so they call their cousins and siblings over to make sure you take your stuff, and only your stuff, and leave.

A rough comparison, but I guess it works enough for what I'm trying to explain. It's less and invasion and more equivalent to when the "Invasion" of Ord Mantel happened a year or so ago. A discussion on who should leave and the actual leaving. It only sparks into combat if someone does something... stupid.

1: IC plot was that we'd made up.
2: Without good OOC relations, there's no way IC stuff can happen because people won't agree to RP with each other. Forcing people to RP with one another works out horribly.
3: The Genevieve storyline was bull and should never have been allowed to happen.
4: Some people on the Pub side during the invasion were stupid and did what the Mandos told them to do without thinking for themselves.
5: An NPC was the person who decompressed the hangar that killed Aaralyn.

1. Just dealt with that earlier in this post.
2. RPing is optional, you're not required to show up. There are consequences for that, but that's as a major faction, not at a writer basis for this situation. If someone doesn't want to write, they don't have to.
3. That's a Republic problem, not a Mandalorian problem.
4. News to me. I saw Mandos and Republic members working side by side after the war crimes started. Methinks someone should have built upon it using the PR tools at hand.
5. An NPC may have done it, but a PC ordered it. Regardless of if that NPC overstepped a boundary, the order's origination came from a PC. We can go back and forth all day, but ultimately it matters less and less on the OOC and entirely on the IC. Bobbie the One Armed Sloth could have pushed the button, but when the other side only knows of, sees, and understands a similar order came from Jimmy the Blind Sloth, they point the finger at Jimmy. It doesn't help that Jimmy acted suspiciously to the other side or did seemingly panicky things after the alleged crimes occurred. IC'ly, they see Jimmy and point the finger there, and in a situation like this, it'd take a lot of effort, time, and a massive amount of digging to prove otherwise, and at best you're looking at both Jimmy and Bobbie getting nailed equally.

 

[Khyros Sunblade]

[member="Popo"]

*shrugs* All I know is what's been posted in the OOC thread, I am brand new to the FA deal (don't even think I have any of the powers yet).

The secession bit was being handled ICly, and is still. Jack is trying to talk Alyesa into staying with the Republic, and the rest of us were doing as Alyesa posted she wished, and we stayed away. I, personally, would have liked to see the talks between Jack and Alyesa finish before an Invasion was announced. That's me though, the crop of writers here are trying our best with what time we have. I've pretty much put all of my other characters on hold so I can be available for rps and discussions on Khyros. That is my decision, I know, but it shows that people are still invested in making the Republic what it should be.