Why Don't You Starfight?

[Beowoof]

One of the things--or perhaps the thing--that makes me fall in love with Star Wars is the starfighter aspect. I've always wanted to be a pilot, and having a nifty aircraft all to your self signifies adventure, thrills, independence, courage, and POWAH. My hero of Star Wars was Wedge Antilles, not Luke Skywalker.

Now, that's my personal story. And don't get me wrong--Star Wars is nothing truly special without the Jedi. I love the duels as well. But, let's be honest. Without the space battles; the starfighters--there is no Star Wars. The most iconic scene of the entire series is not Luke Skywalker vs. Darth Vader over Endor, or even Luke vs. Vader on Cloud City. What made the movies so memorable (and kept the series going behind the original film) was the Battle of Yavin. You had dogfights, you had bomber runs, and you had that feeling that the pilots were something bigger than just flyboys. The first time you watched that movie, you were on the edge of your seat as each man ran the gauntlet... and almost all of them died. But their little snubfighters, their teamwork and sacrifices, and their flying instincts proved to be a match for the gigantic planet-killer.

The truth is, starfighting is an essential part of this universe, and it's really not difficult. We're not even talking about the big 'fleeting' here. You may argue that it's not a 'solo' effort, but neither is ground-pounding. A starfighter needs a squadron, but a warrior needs an army. And guess what? You only need about 6 to 12 units, compared to the handwaved centuries of armies that are just there to be slaughtered so your character can walk in unscathed while his unquestioning men burn.

If you believe that a starfighter pilot is not as powerful as a Jedi/Sith, then you would be mistaken there, as well. One renegade starfighter could level a skyscraper. A bomber could decimate an entire block. Both could kill a Jedi.

Oh, and there's also a form of dueling for starfighters, unlike with fleets. It's called a dogfight.


So, my question is: Why don't people like to write starfighter battles?
There is no wrong answer if you're being honest. I'd just like to know why SWRP isn't into this, or if we're just waiting for someone to pave the way.

 

[Saran Drast]

Any fleeter will tell you that fighters wind up being nothing but background noise. So everyone wants to command a capitol ship. There's no reward for being a fighter pilot (even though a well-done fighter squadron can take down space stations....), so everyone becomes a fleeter.

 

[Commander Xillian]

I like star fighters, but none of my characters are the sorts to utilize it. Hardy likes tanks, Scyluc likes space stations. Just doesn't fit the task, sadly.

 

[Ashin Varanin]

Ashin flies a TIE Exalt, from Santhe/Sienar.

Jorus flies an Aleph, from Santhe/Sienar, when he's not dogfighting in the Gypsymoth.

Rave flies a Rassilon, from Silk.

Ember flies a Naga, from Baktoid.

I may fleet a ton, but I love me some starfighter combat, and indulge whenever possible.

 

[Beowoof]

Any fleeter will tell you that fighters wind up being nothing but background noise.

(By the way, I find this very true in regards to most fleeters and their opinions.)

I think that's a horrible misconception, however. Modern-day fighters are able (and designed) to 'lone wolf it'. They are an effective one-man, one-machine devastator. Technically--if you throw out the moral issues--a few unchecked squadrons of attack aircraft today can end a war in one fell swoop. The only involvement of a fleet of any sort is to dispatch said aircraft.

 

[Sarge Potteiger]

Fighters and ground forces are largely background noise to fleeters. Fleeters and ground forces are largely background noise to fighters. Fleeters and fighters are largely background noise to ground pounders. Ain't nothin' new about that.

I don't mind the idea of starfighting. Just ain't that good at it, and Sarge is a mediocre pilot at best.

 

[Garza]

Yes I would love to see more starfighter roles being played. However a lot of people are in here for the "Shiny lightsaber, shiny gun, shiny armor" deal. I mean Lightsabers? only franchise that has a very fething huge oligopoly on them. I mean you do see here and there a few games having cameos of a lightsaber and call it something else as a joke. But realistically who came up with the idea? Starwars. And that's why people are here. They want to control someone who want's a Saber.

Now there are people who use more military people to do the "Feth you Force users! Imma pop a cap in ya ass." But there are more people who want to use one of the glowing blades of light, rather than fly in a ship where just about All PC's take little to no damage. Yes you should, but it's harder to do a starfighter fight as well simply because of all the complex moves and spins and dives. WHile having a sword is as simple as "he swung it at his right arm." Done.

I think its because of two things.

1. Lack of people wanting starfighter roles
2. Some complexity issues.

 

[Jsc]

I like writing Squadron dynamics but I've never found enough active people to fill out a roster of PC's. However, one of my most successful threads in fact was DM'ing for a group of three X-Wing Pilots. I ran the enemy TIE squadron and the SAMs while they provided air support to a ground convoy of NPC hero characters in armored vehicles. And yes, they did constantly remind each other to "Do a Barrel Roll".

Also, "Force-Squadron Mind-Meld" is awesome and "Force-Guided" Bombs are dumb. >.<''

 

[Blackhot]

[member="Beowoof"] I'm interested in piloting, I just haven't gotten around to making a character for it yet. I think you're going the with wrong tract here. Is a fighter-centric fleeting doctrine viable or even superior to a more ship-centric fleeting doctrine? In the real world and the (canonical) Star Wars universe, of course. The B-Wing says hi. However, I think the problem just boils down to a lack of interest. This forum seems like to focus more on the more personal "hero" and dueling aspect, with all the large scale fighting being pushed into the background. Even in the movies, large scale battles were just background noise to what was going on with the main characters. It's like with mecha shows where the main story doesn't actually have anything to do with the flashy mecha fights. It's all dressing.From another thread dealing with the lack of interest in fleeting in general, I know many are perfectly content just getting their dogfighting/fleeting fix playing video games. What dogfighters and fleeters should do is come up with ways to make their activities more appealing to people. Aside from the interest problem, I think the other issue is that other people just feel intimidated. We should try to make the activities more accessible and rewarding for those folks. Make some more good dogfighting/fleeting threads to show them the ropes.

 

[Lysle of the Hydian Way]

I'm interested in RPing a pilot, but I just feel that there isn't enough focus on it. Sure, I pilot once every dozen threads on Lysle, but it isn't starfighting. The groups that do get together as Squadrons - from personal experience - don't get together to RP, and so nothing happens.

 

[Beowoof]

[member="Blackhot"]

I'm not disagreeing, necessarily. But I'm confused as to how starfighting is intimidating. To me, PVP is worse--has dire consequences for your character, specifically--and everyone seems to have their 'god' leveled up with their RPG-style 'upgrades', and has armor in some metal or organic Force-repellant padding I've never even heard of. By the same reasoning you gave, I could just play KOTOR and get the full ranking experience.

And movies/stories will always be character-centric. No one finds a novel about Army X attacks Army Y to be interesting. That's called a strategy book and fits a completely different mindset. This is fleeting's downside in attractiveness. But starfighting isn't like that. It does focus on the protagonist, who happens to perform his feats in his personal ship. And while there are complex maneuvers and stuff, it just takes a little Internet search. Seriously, I have no idea whatever these Force powers are that people use here. For all I know, they could be making them up on the spot.

I feel like starfighting is viable. But you may be right. This may not be the community for it.

 

[Nyxie]

I only read the question, and my answer is that the question is a trick; I love starfighter battles! In fact, I have both seen and experienced some very decent ones from [member="Aedan Miles"] to [member="Arrbi Betna"] to several others. It is simply a matter of personal preference.

Aynea has an entire collection of starfighters which I have been working on for several months, including:

• An MMS-510.A2 Solace-Class Heavy Starfighter from Ri'ess Regal Drives
• A Rassillion-Class Elite Starfighter from Silk Holdings
• A modified IFS-66 Firebird Starfighter from Koensayr Manufacturing
• An XR-07 Naga Starfighter from Baktoid Industrial Systems
• A Ventus Fighter Interceptor from Ri'ess Regal Drives
• A CIS Languor-Class Elite Starfighter from Ri'ess Regal Drives/Techno Union
• A BR-0100 Neta'norac Starfighter from Mandal Hypernautics
• A Beskad-Class Starfighter from Mandal Hypernautics
• A remade Aleph-Class Sith Starfighter originally from Sienar Fleet Systems
• An Ariamis-Class Stargoddess Fighter Type-One from Ri'ess Regal Drives
• And my "daily driver" Deathbell from Ri'ess Regal Drives

And also working on getting a modern Stealth-X from some Republic company that seemingly refuses to sell to me (apparently Silver Jedi doesn't cut it).

So yeah, I am a huge enthusiast. Like I said, to each his own.

To anyone who's played the Ace Combat franchise, there in is proof that air combat can have brilliant, engaging story and be more than just tedium.

 

[Ellie Mors]

[member="Beowoof"]
I prefer to use a different set of abilities. I chose star wars because I like the use of the force and lightsabers, not because of piloting. While I may sometimes, on occasion, have a starfighter battle, it is not a preference nor is it something I like to do often. The only reason is because of my preference, not any complex reasoning. It isn't unattractive, it just isn't my thing.

 

[Ordo]

I fly a Vhe'viin interceptor, Rassalion, TIE exalt, Prudii, YT-2000, and anything else I can buy, borrow or steal.

Wanna dogfight? Tag me in I'd love to oblige.

 

[Scherezade deWinter]

I suck at writing space battles and derive no fun from it.

 

[Ashin Varanin]

A dozen threads asking why people don't fleet or don't dogfight will never make as big a difference as getting out there and creating two or three open threads, with something at stake, focused on fleeting or dogfighting. It's been done and it works. If you want to popularize something, do it, and make it look fun in the process.

 

[Tefka]

Luke vs Vader on Cloud City was less iconic than the Battle of Yavin? That's some serious reaching there, OP. The main problem with your poll is twofold.

1. Not everyone wants to fight all the time.
2. Role-play is mostly character driven. Not starship driven.

 

[Nyxie]

In Soviet Russia, starship drives you!​

 

[Caius Flavian]

Star fighters... Those pesky little buggers blew up one death star. Then they just had to go and run past our blockades as we slagged ice... Then they had to kamikaze our super star destroyer AND blow up our second death star... Pesky pesky pesky... Now I'm new to this board, but I'm in no way unfamiliar with rping and star wars so let me throw my two cents into the meter here.

[member="Beowoof"] [member="Sarge Potteiger"] [member="Saran Drast"]

I think Sarge and Saran here takes the cake with the supposed issue here.

Everyone has their preference.

I'm personally a fleeter of ships rather than armies. As much as I enjoyed GMing the droid armies fighting my PC Jedi commanders in the big picture it is tedious.
My view of star fighting is that I just am not a star fighter pilot. In my personal life I'm much more familiar with the inner workings of ships than I am with aircraft.
So I drift to what I know best (although I'm really a medical professional , that stuff tends to get fairy dusted in roleplays... or in this case the FORCE).

What I will say is that In my experience with people Roleplaying pilots has taught me a few things.

• Always be aware of what they are doing, if they are leading a squadron on a bombing run against that annoying frigate poking your shields then make sure that your Grand Admiral/Admiral/Captain character (whatever rank they may be) is aware of the impact that will have.
• Know that your pilots are always the wild cards in a void battle, inexperienced ones may leave you open to attack by the enemy fighters. Experienced ones may gain you Void Superiority even Supremacy.
• A healthy dose of realism is always good to keep at hand. Starfighters have the luxury of attacking from any direction. capital ships are not flying in circles trying to dog fight, no they are participating in a multi fighter boxing match. Exchanging heavy punches, starfighers are akin to having a few other fighters in the ring, only their punches are lighter. However one good jab can throw off the heavy weight giving his/her opponent the chance to knock out. Hell even the star fighters could achieve a knock out if the opportunity arises. The point of this bullet is for us fleeters to take a measured hit!

A brief story; While fighting as the droids I threw a few vulture droids at my friends armies because I noticed they didn't have a single fighter in the air. Oh were they pissed. In fact one of them actually called a gunship in just to go back to base and get his Jedi star fighter (A Delta-7 Aethersprite). It was something they completely overlooked in the planning stage. Just a single star fighter can throw off a battle plan whether its on the ground or in space.

I look at the battle of Hoth as a good example; for some reason the Empire never deployed any star fighters to support their ground troops (whether out of sheer arrogance or because planetary conditions) thus giving Air Supremacy to the rebels (darn rebels!!! always blowing up my pie) allowing several AT-AT's to be taken out. Did it really affect the battle in the rebels favor? I would argue yes! Because with out star fighters (or in this case air fighters) more personnel would have died and the base would have been overwhelmed earlier reducing the evacuations overall success.

Star fighting is not for everyone and not every character likes it! I look at Obi-wan kenobi as a good example of this versus that of Anakin. Obi often expressed his disdain for personally flying and fighting, he still did but that is not where his character excels (witty and an excellent duelist and jedi is where he excels at) while Anakin loved star fighting and was often leading the charge in space battles.

One thing to bear in mind is that of us fleeters can be so self absorbed. The opening of Revenge of the Sith featured hundreds of Capital ships duking it out. The cinematic focus though was on star fighters with our brave white shirts exploding and the two heroes blasting their away through the battle to board Grievous's ship. All those capital ships flying around in utter nonsensical formations (it looked more like an orbital parking garage gone haywire with every driver shooting each others for trying to take their spot!) were us fleeters being... well, back ground noise!! Lmao!

I would say Ember has the right words of advice. I will personally always promote and encourage star fighting in what ever roleplays i'm participating in as a fleeter. I may command a capital ship but dammit I want (writers) pilots to make some noise and bring the pain! Soooo promote star fighting. Gather up those writers from across all factions and get some dog fights going! Maybe open up an academy for training star fighters In Character within your respective factions. Or even a public one! Solutions are endless!

Whew I think I over ran my meter here! better grab moar CHANGE...
I think these threads (there seems to be a considerable amount of them) are just displaying a general mood of what writer demographic is like. Which is perhaps more in favor of saber and blaster in the face! In the end its all about having fun and generating lively discussions!

[member="Ember Rekali"]
[member="Nessarose deWinter"]
[member="Darth Sinna"]
[member="Countess Xyhn"]

 

[Oka Osaa]

[member="Tefka"] really explained it well. Although we need more fleeting, the character development is more important through other skills.

I'm a Vice Admiral in the Nova Outbound Fleet, if you want to confront our power, go to the Admiral. [member="Cross Ikon"]