In My Opinion, This Is Niche Mentality & How It's Killing Smaller Factions

[Tefka]

GA nominations are an internal dispute and do not affect other factions than the GA. If you have an issue, take it up with the current GA admins or there. This thread is not an outlet for that.

Let it go, or we will start thread banning or closing this thread.

Double post for posterity

 

[NightSister]

I missed the original debate and I only vaguely know what's happening, but I'm not entirely sure why this is how the matter is being discussed.

But while we're here...(!)

There's a reason the PM box is right at the top of the menu with a little envelope icon so you can't miss it. There's a reason Discord messages show up right in your face with the avatar blinking at you from the sidebar.

Communication is important, y'all.

 

[Ashin Varanin]

I don't think the real issue is being approachable, though that’s part of it. I think the real issue is whether someone sees me (or another oldtimer) as being more likely to take an old OOC associate's side on an IC level, all else being equal.

Looking back, there's a degree of truth to that. More to the point, though, oldtimers tangle or mess with each other IC all the time, regardless of whether they're friends or enemies or neutral at an OOC level. Due to the sheer volume of content on the board, and occasional high-profile team-ups, that kind of gets lost. Your average member probably gets left with 'they all know each other; they'll all team up; I shouldn't even ask.'

Ask. We're here to write and have fun in a play-by-post roleplaying game. When the right opportunity comes along, I've teamed up with writers I don't know or even dislike, and taken IC swings at characters written by people I've known for a decade or more. And my behavior is not an anomaly among oldtimers. Every single one I know, including people I tend to avoid, is open to making new friends and teaming up with random people to do cool things, for better or for worse. Do we do a bad job of publicizing that and making ourselves approachable? Maybe, yeah, but I definitely see effort.

Let me be real blunt here. The people implicated in this whole thing? We're not best friends. We work at cross purposes​ now and again; we argue or disagree. Some of us RP together often, some don't. If any of us stages a raid or a rebellion or something, it's often with radically different groups of people, including many new members. This time it was this particular selection of people, who happened to hold various roles on the board. Another time, it might have been a different assortment entirely. This whole thing was a perfect storm of shiny targets and bad optics. Are there lessons to be learned? Sure. But just keep a sense of proportion about this stuff.

Back to my original point: if you go to anyone on that list and say 'I have a compelling IC reason to raid something Jon controls,’ they'll either tell you why that particular plan is a bad idea, or they'll jump in and fun things happen. Don't assume that oldtimers stick together on IC things.

Raid us. We'll help.

 

[Tefka]

[member="Ashin Karrde"]

To add, as I've always seen eye to eye with Ashin on many things, the issue is also with many people being so complacent with what they're used to doing - especially the 'oldtimers' - that they don't stop to think about how it looks to others who either may be new or less experienced.

Ashin is a great example of someone who has years to establish his reputation as a fair gamer and a well respected gamer. Others, however, are hinging their bets entirely on their factions being successful as it could be their first and only one - and not quite as whimsical with their decisions to launch invasions or rebellions as an 'oldtimer' who cares less about the outcome and more about the experience.

The longer one spends here, the less they'll care about launching a Rebellion in 5 hours, because been there, done that. Their reputation is already established and they'll move on to the next project that excites them when one fails... with ease.

But some new dude and 3 of his friends who just got on the map with their first faction?

They've never been more invested.

This is what I am accusing veterans of this forum of being occasionally ignorant to, and why the burden falls more to them than any other to fix it.

 

[Ashin Varanin]

[member="Tefka"]

That's a very good point. It's been years since I've been 100% invested in a single Chaos project, but I remember how fired up I was about running the Lords of the Fringe, and how irritated I got when people pulled a fast one to get the drop on us. That's something I'll try to remember from now on.

 

[Amelia von Sorenn]

Having gotten my joke post out of the way and having some time to sit down after reading the entirety of the post (while not at work).


Did the Staff members (those implied in the wrongdoing and those left out) made a mistake?

Yes.

Did they do anything that no one else would have done in a similar situation?

No.

Did their "alt padding" look suspicious?

Yes, though no more so than alt padding by members in other factions.

Should Staff be punished and made an example of?

No more so than anyone else who has been accused of alt padding.

Does Staff "Hate newcomers and have it out for small factions"?

A resounding NO.

I personally find that much of what those individuals are being accused of falls on its face. We must remember that the Staff are also writers. Beyond their duties as members of Staff, they also have character accounts and from time to time they'll write.

I have had the pleasure of writing with Staff members in the past, notably Spencer as well as those that have come and gone from various Staff Positions, as far back as I can remember. I remember interacting with Staff member's characters with my first official character on the site Tasgetius when I joined back in 2011-2012.

I find that this accusation that the Staff "Hates new comers" is just absurd. Nor do I believe that they "have it out for smaller factions" or that "Niche mentality is killing smaller factions"

As Tefka said, Niches happen. They happen in every day life. You have your friends you hang out with because they formed a clique or niche. Just like when you write on an RP site you're bound to end up in a niche or a clique of your own.

If you feel that the Staff are targeting Minor Factions and killing them, or that somehow it is unfair for the Staff to focus their characters and attention on an idea then there is a simple solution.

Do not play the Faction game.

You are not obliged to play the Map Game nor are you obliged to join a faction. If you want to write, then write. Though I do not feel that it is appropriate to start claiming that Staff are trying to kill your minor faction just because they rally behind an idea that isn't yours or that happens to be against your own.

 

[Tefka]

I have no idea where you're getting your ideas or why you're so hostile about it (three responses through three threads, really?) but nobody thinks "Staff hates newcomers."

If we did, that would really defeat the purpose.

Staff isn't being punished. And we don't need defending.

What we need is to distance ourselves from the limelight of these discussions so members have no reason to question where we stand, and so that our members know that when there is nowhere else to go, they can still come to us.

 

[Kenrath]

opcorn:

 

[Eugen Aker]

[member="Siobhan Kerrigan"]

Hi there. Your personal attack against me in response to honest feedback about the GA (and I guess we can throw the TA into here, now) perfectly highlights why some have apprehensions about dealing with the faction. Anyway, much of my problem has little to do with the GA itself, but with the entire system, as detailed in the last third of my response. Our map system as it is gives rise to the shenanigans that are finally being addressed now.

With respect to what [member="Tefka"] said, I'm not going to get into the nomination business here, but I don't like people second-guessing my intentions and I would like to take the chance to defend myself. It was simply a matter of me seeing Raziel's self-nomination thread earlier today after chiming into Tefka's thread and thinking to myself, "hey, with all the concerns me and others have just voiced, maybe I can use this opportunity to work myself into a position to fix them in order to make a more positive roleplaying experience for the faction and everyone else on the board?" That was the same thought process I had as I ran for FO of the Galactic Republic and Silver Jedi Order. Nothing duplicitous about that.

I'm trying my best not to assume the worst from my peers here as I can see they are just trying to enjoy themselves on the board, so I would ask for the same courtesy from you. If you would like to chat to help demystify the rationale behind my actions, then feel free to shoot me a PM or contact me over Discord.

Any other thoughts on my original points, though?

 

[Matreya]

The connection between the two, as I see it, is perception. Perception of the connection, or of there not being one - of the nomination of an already established controlled power moving onto another power, a much larger one, being an issue that could be approached, or not. Etcetera. It seemed, as stated, a shark like snipe for power. Attack the head, and you get the body under you. Then the body is where you want, will do what you want with it, etcetera.

However, I, by no means, am trying to move onto [member="Tefka"]'s ban list, so I will not approach the topic more than just my defense of a perceived viable connection.

In [member="Siobhan Kerrigan"]'s case, I did not note a point of implication, that Asira was attempting a veritable trashing of the GA. Than again, that once more returns to the perception of matters at hand. While one might audaciously attribute the prior, I defend the latter. Hence differing perceptions. Sio pointed out a fault in a similar status quo, understandable considering the approach wrought by the OP.

Simply the same.

Either or, however one happens to perceive it, one must also concede logically then, and admit that should you feel one way, another can (likely does too) feel the opposite. Which I do.

About all of this. Jon is a good guy by most means, Cira is a great person to chat too and has never given me bad vibes during interaction, just the same as Sio is incredibly powerful IC yet damned equal in the give and get OOC.

I do not believe any of this is a blatant, cut and dry, black and white, attack on any other. It is a simple... Thing. Poodoo happens. This does not mean it is an aggressive act.

My point has been said.

[member="Natasi Fortan"]

 

[Alan]

I'm gonna need a thorough drawing with crayons to understand this.

Also, I want to eat the crayons.

On a more serious note, I think that this is a case of people wanting to roleplay together, albeit with a bit of an agenda to it. Which, I don't think is entirely that much out of the ordinary for the site. I don't think it was maliciously intended, then again, I'm about as involved in this as I am active on this site lately.