Mandalorians

[Eugen Aker]

I have never once said I don't care to write with anyone. I don't know any of the new people in the Republic to make that determination. I'm actually fairly open and game to write with new people. You obviously don't know me. :|

*Raises hand.*

 

[The End Narrator]

[member=Alyesa Organa]

I feel your story designs are plenty agreeable; as I stated before it presents us all with a unique writing opportunity. My foci are properly placed: On continuing Republic story lines within a positive RP environment and helping the faction as a whole grow and flourish.
Ali may not know your character, but the stories involved shape writers as much as they shape IC interactions. Your character does not know Ali and yet you've provided your thoughts on how the Republic should endure the situation. Knowing a character IC should not matter when we're exchanging ideas as people.

As a final thought on the topic, I feel that coordinating at least some aspect of this story with the rest of the Republic would perhaps be a positive step in good faith toward constructing good relations between writers.
"Letting it all play out" does not tell anyone else in the Republic what that might entail. This might include drastic actions being taken against the Royals of Alderaan, or none at all until relations finally erode entire between writers when they didn't have to in the first place. Either way it provides no one involved with anything positive to base later relations off of.
There's also the fact that if we simply go hands off with Alderaan the stories written there might be used to drastically disparage the Republic in the event of an invasion. It would not do well for the Republic to simply allow Mandalorians or others involved to act in Republic territory that could be used against the faction without even an attempt at intervention.

This is just an observation I'm making; if non-communication/non-interaction is what you are insisting on, then it's something I'm certain we'll respect. I for one have no intentions of taking action against Alderaan, nor would I suggest any, either as a writer or a character.

Alyesa actually has never stated what should happened to Ali Hadrix. She has had no official discussion, meeting or talks. She just understands what she has read/seen in the Holonews. In regards to my discussions with the Republic writers regarding what I've done with the planet in terms of storytelling? There has been absolutely no interest in the planet beyond it's resources for the Republic for so long.

If the Republic desires action against Alderaan, punishment for Alyesa, etc. IC Actions have IC Consequences. Just as I'm aware that Alyesa will have consequences for her actions of rejecting the Republic and telling them to gtfo her world. Not quite sure what possible actions the Republic can take against a sovereign government - but I've seen some crazy shit happen before.

I have never said non-interaction, I've accepted Sparrow's invite to a sponsored event to discuss. I never said no-communication. No one has bothered to reach out to Alyesa. Would I expect you to march troops onto Alderaan and try something silly? Potentially - will force be met with force? Yup. I have no idea the mindset of the Republic politicians or military at this point and what they're going to try to do if anyone bucks back against them. IC or OOC - so a build up of Royal Military Forces happened and necessary steps to ensure the sovereignty and safety of Alderaan were taken.

I let things play out because I don't like to plan every step - I like to let things happen organically.

 

[The End Narrator]

*Raises hand.*

Not sure why you're raising your hand...

*points* I've tagged you twice and you forgot me!

The feels....

 

[Eugen Aker]

[member="Alyesa Organa"] Oh, I must have missed those notifications. I wanted to head over to Alderaan to see what was going on between the Organas and Mandalorians. Then also to discuss some trade deals and build a rapport.

 

[The End Narrator]

[member="Alyesa Organa"] Oh, I must have missed those notifications. I wanted to head over to Alderaan to see what was going on between the Organas and Mandalorians. Then also to discuss some trade deals and build a rapport.

Double check the threads you jumped in with myself and Faith. I responded in kind but was unsure if you saw the responses but had to move on. Feel free to PM me your Skype if you have it and I'll add you and we can discuss setting something up!

 

[Eugen Aker]

[member="Alyesa Organa"] Yes, I just missed the responses. Let me look for them, and then I'll send a PM.

 

[Faith Organa]

[member="Suravi Teigra"] you were tagged but you've changed your name since you joined. Just reach out for us. We are therey

 

[Captain Larraq]

[member="Khyros Sunblade"]

Seeing as the Mandalorian invasion was RL weeks after the initial post that spawned all of this poodoo, but set only hours after I am feeling like a little leeway is warranted to us (the GR) and that the Mandos can wait until we've been given the list that Ember gave Faith.


And seeing the way the wind is blowing, if we decide to place this "within hours" of the terms being given to Faith, it is going to make some people look mighty foolish with their ultimatums.


All I am saying is people need to give leeway where they take leeway, the Senate is currently trying to work this all out.

For the record. The Danger Will Robinson thread started December 27th. I sent the Republic FO invasion notification on January 1st. The thread itself started weeks later because Circe got in Mantic's ear and got the man to utterly derail negotiations at every opportunity, going so far as to launch IC threads aimed at retconning or preventing the IC reasons for the invasion, after the invasion negotiations had already begun.

The only problem as I see it, is that it would take an invasion to wrest control of Alderaan away from the Republic. That is a lead in to a war that neither the Republic nor the Mandalorians can truly win.

OOC, the Mandalorians volunteered to cut away half of their territory on the map, and it was done. So, OOC... Alderaan can leave any time it wants to, so long as it is agreed OOC.

IC? Mandalorians have more going for them atm than you'd think.



[member="Lady Kay"]

Also arrests warrants should be laid out for Kol’k Oto and Captain Macer Heln as they are the real culprits.

Yes. Because the commander and chief of the armed forces giving direct orders to vent atmosphere to the hangers and any "lost sections", then instructing all civilians (including mandalorian civilians) to evacuate to the Hangars and flee the station... no. She's not to blame. The people who followed her orders are totally the criminals.


[member="Lady Kay"]

Planets cannot just leave a faction

Yes they can. The mandalorians got rid of half their territory. IC, they passed it off as Death Watch agression. OOC, some members of the faction wanted to protest the map game by lessening the Mandalorian faction's footprint.

Then there's Ord Mantell. Yall did an entire invasion that was basically "please dont fight us Mr. Mandalorians. Here. Have a planet. Can we have peace talks now? We're withdrawing our forces and everything!"

 

[Captain Larraq]

[member="Khyros Sunblade"]

The Mandalorians, who are realistically only embodied by the persons of Draco Vereen, Captain Larraq, and Olivia Dem'adas at the moment, should be afforded the opportunity to provide their grievances to the Republic, as there is no equivalent to the World Court here on Chaos.They should also be told to go home in regards to Alderaan, as there is no realistic way they can support what amounts to an invasion force on the opposite side of Republic space from them.

lol. I'm 2/3rds of the Mandalorians.

 

[sabrina]

[member="Captain Larraq"] but what about Sabine and Rhodessa

 

[Captain Larraq]

[member="sabrina"]


Don't ask me. Apparently Draco and I are the only ones to catch their attention.

 

[sabrina]

[member="Captain Larraq"] I can see that making Sabine quite angry, that might not end well for them.

 

[Ali Hadrix]

[member=Alyesa Organa]

"Alyesa actually has never stated what should happened to Ali Hadrix. She has had no official discussion, meeting or talks."

I was referring to yourself, as your previous comment seemed to be referencing my OOC involvement in discussion regarding Alderaan. Turns out we misinterpreted one another. Ali has no opinion regarding Alderaan as she is not aware of its attempt to secede, and has not commented on the issue.

"There has been absolutely no interest in the planet beyond it's resources for the Republic for so long."

That's unfortunate, though I think it's fair to say that not every member of the faction will view each planet with the same amount of attachment as you have for Alderaan. I am particularly fond of several worlds, particularly Yavin IV and Mandalore, which hold special places in my history RP'ing. Yet I do not expect the same reverence from others in regards to this.

"No one has bothered to reach out to Alyesa...I have no idea the mindset of the Republic politicians or military at this point and what they're going to try to do if anyone bucks back against them."

I'm curious about this, as communication is a two-way street and I feel you're faulting us for not reaching out to you. That's just a point of view, not an accusation, I just have to make the observation that the change in leadership within the Republic recently has been rather public, nigh unmistakable for someone that has so much invested in a world of that faction. I of course do not have the whole picture, but had you reached out to myself or any of the newer writers on the leadership team, more amicable IC relationships could have easily taken route.
I'm not sure if I am comfortable being faulted IC for something which most of us were unaware was happening (or rather, not happening). It denies us the opportunity to attempt to make good on RP using our characters.

Of course, this is something we can clearly change, as Jack has endeavored to do so already. I wish your discussions with him the best and hope that you come away from them feeling reaffirmed in a positive manner toward the writers leading the Republic as much as the characters of the faction itself.

 

[Ali Hadrix]

[member=Captain Larraq]

"Yes. Because the commander and chief of the armed forces giving direct orders to vent atmosphere to the hangers and any "lost sections", then instructing all civilians (including mandalorian civilians) to evacuate to the Hangars and flee the station... no. She's not to blame. The people who followed her orders are totally the criminals."

Not sure why you mentioned evacuation orders; when an enemy invades a densely populated civilian location, evacuation is the first order of business for non-combatants as it serves to get them away from the fighting.

Ali's orders were specific to Mandalorian invaders, who were known to utilize vacuum-sealed armor. Even then we were trying to spare your lives and minimize casualties. How kind of us.
I don't have Lucas-signed canon copy of Republic military code, regulation and doctrine to show you, but it goes without saying that such a tactic would be used only in the confirmed absence of non-combatants and individual leaders would be trusted to exercise sound judgment in making such a call.
It goes without saying that Republic soldiers and leaders would never utilize such a tactic with civilians around, and those that do would be held accountable, hence Captain Heln, who did not protest Kol'k Oto's employment of the tactic.
What you are describing did not happen, or that would have been written instead. You don't get to invent your own version of someone else's narrative and purport it to be the Truth.

EDIT: And Ali never mentioned the hangars, that was Oto's idea. Ali's orders were a legitimate contingency plan for overrun sectors that lacked a civilian presence. It doesn't take an idiot to hammer that nail.

 

[Popo]

 

[Captain Larraq]

[member=Captain Larraq]

"Yes. Because the commander and chief of the armed forces giving direct orders to vent atmosphere to the hangers and any "lost sections", then instructing all civilians (including mandalorian civilians) to evacuate to the Hangars and flee the station... no. She's not to blame. The people who followed her orders are totally the criminals."

Not sure why you mentioned evacuation orders; when an enemy invades a densely populated civilian location, evacuation is the first order of business for non-combatants as it serves to get them away from the fighting.

Ali's orders were specific to Mandalorian invaders, who were known to utilize vacuum-sealed armor. Even then we were trying to spare your lives and minimize casualties. How kind of us.
I don't have Lucas-signed canon copy of Republic military code, regulation and doctrine to show you, but it goes without saying that such a tactic would be used only in the confirmed absence of non-combatants and individual leaders would be trusted to exercise sound judgment in making such a call.
It goes without saying that Republic soldiers and leaders would never utilize such a tactic with civilians around, and those that do would be held accountable, hence Captain Heln, who did not protest Kol'k Oto's employment of the tactic.
What you are describing did not happen, or that would have been written instead. You don't get to invent your own version of someone else's narrative and purport it to be the Truth.

EDIT: And Ali never mentioned the hangars, that was Oto's idea. Ali's orders were a legitimate contingency plan for overrun sectors that lacked a civilian presence. It doesn't take an idiot to hammer that nail.

http://starwarsrp.net/topic/77102-capitalist-with-a-gun-mandalorian-invasion-of-roche-mando-vs-republic/?p=1138891

"Typical pairs, okay? Get to front line defensive areas outside the hangars and any other access points. Mount your defenses there. If you lose ground, retreat and seal it off behind you, then use the overrides to vent the lost sections to space. We'll be able to get plenty of them that way. Once it's done, clear the vented areas, and reestablish fighting positions. If that's not possible, use your best judgement. Astor, Wolcraft, you're sticking with me."

"Whatever the Mandalorians say, they're going to kill everyone. Helping your people will be an afterthought, nothing more. Get to your transports and flee to the Republic fleet, from there we'll get you out of the system until this is all over. Same goes for your personnel and civvies. Understood?"

If you're having a hard time keeping track of your character's action and your NPC's actions, I'd suggest cutting back a bit. From an OOC perspective, I've never seen someone use NPCs as you did in an invasion. They are only ever used as a point of view, as a stand-in naval officer or starfighter pilot, or as the occasional foot soldiers.

NPCing a political authority figure in a competative roleplay environment to manipulate the IC perspective into being more in your favor, or just to have said NPC perform "questionable acts" that you want to perform for their tactical advantage, but can't do yourself because your character is a "good guy".... They are not the acts of a writer who shows respect for other writers, nor are they acts that promote fair and balanced roleplay.

Honestly, had you been a member of the Mandalorian faction you'd have been kicked from the thread by the second or third page.

However. That is OOC.

IC, Ali Hadrix offered insult to the Mando'ade and gave orders that directly resulted in the avoidable deaths of numerous civilians.

The Republic is suppose to be the good guys of the board. You don't vent atmosphere on a civilian station. That is something the Galactic Empire or Sith Empire would do. Even the Mandalorians don't pull that crap.

You attack a valid military target and some civilians happen to die in the attack? Well shit. It happens. You avoid it when you can, but don't lose a war because you were afraid to throw a punch.

Canonically and historically to Chaos... if the stakes are high enough and the odds the Mando'ade face are stacked high enough against them... They will destroy entire worlds for a military victory.

They don't like doing it. They avoid it. But sometimes it is simply what must be done to protect the next generation of Mando'ade.

 

[sabrina]

Okay I think the ooc may be taking over the ic

I suggest take a break, and get on with one trying to arrest [member="Ali Hadrix"] (she decides if that is successful or not)
Then a trial in SSC space, with or without her, and she could make lawyer up to defend her in her absence.
Then we go from there.

As for Alderaan and Eshan yes there are political differences at the mo, but unless an rpj rules otherwise, the only way they can leave republic, is through an invasion. As faction members, may decide to make echani character just to oppose you in the ic, or more alderaan nobles, or even a peasant revolt against our actions in trying to leave.

So leave yes it will make story, but that is something yet to be written

 

[Ali Hadrix]

[member=Captain Larraq]

I've been writing argumentative research papers for years, pulling quotes out of context isn't going to win you any ground.

Just before the post you quoted, Larraq made this statement in his: "...We will annex this system into our protection before the Republic has the opportunity to bring the Verpine people under heel."

A blatant declaration of hostile intent. You kicked the door down with that one right there mate. So quit whining about the defending military commander boasting to you over the phone, that grew stale two weeks ago, and unless you're insane, is no grounds for continuing a military campaign that will end the lives of countless people.

"Mandalorians only shoot soldiers" is a ridiculous excuse for propagating war across other peoples' borders.

Here's another one that shows the inverse nature of your position in this discussion: "...I fear that even now, the Republic moves to bring Roche under thumb through military force."

The dominion we wrote prior to the invasion comprised of the Republic military assisting the natives of Roche in repelling a pirate invasion, fighting off a Sith Lord and ended with the Verpine embracing membership with the Republic. If you want to play us off as the bad guys, you've got to do better than getting all the IC facts wrong.

And don't attack my use of the Verpine government, the planet was the Republic's. You can't impugn my writing of the Verpine delegation while simultaneously supporting the Organa's right to control an entire planet and successfully secede from it's owned faction.

I don't play host to double standards, so knock it off.

If the Mandalorian faction had wanted to avoid civilian deaths, they wouldn't have started by jamming an invasion force onto a civilian station, ranting about sovereignty and waving their guns about. Your foreign policy sucks. Ali gave you the opportunity to initiate amicable discussion and you ignored her, then continued moving in.
That whole screw up is on you once you decided to show up at all. You don't get to put a gun to someone's head and then claim the moral high ground when someone innocent gets shot in the resulting scuffle. Get the feth out dude. lol

"You attack a valid military target and some civilians happen to die in the attack? Well poodoo. It happens. You avoid it when you can, but don't lose a war because you were afraid to throw a punch."

That's right, you attack a valid military target. Like Nickel One, a civilian station. Come on, you're basically giving your intellectual credibility away like it's Black Tuesday.

I love this idea that world-burning is acceptable when it's Mandalorians defending their own, but they're perfectly happy judging others for accidents that occur while the Mandalorians are stretching their legs into other governments' territories with military forces.

You're done, I can't take any more. This is killing me. lol

 

[Hira Mitsae]

Planets cannot just leave a faction and join another, especially those gained by dominions. Board rules don't work that way.

Untrue. The faction staff of any major faction can always file a request in the Map Updates thread to have worlds of their map territory go neutral. As already stated by Larraq, the Mandalorians did just that when they felt the faction was way too focused on the map game and the drama that comes with it.

Alderaan, Eshan and any other planets can go neutral... the Republic Faction Staff just has to allow them to do so. Or the Mandalorians can invade the worlds and help them secede.

Your call, mates.

 

[Ali Hadrix]

Additionally: I totally get that Larraq's views are IC, and trust me, that's not bleeding into OOC for me. But the nature of Larraq's IC position is a fallacy, an irony.