Balancing Reportabellions

[Ever Dawnracer]

[member="Runi Verin"]
If only one party stands to benefit, it's a reasonable assumption they have something to do with the proposal.

Even if all they did was whine and annoy Tefka.

 

[Reverance]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

It's not a reasonable assumption and you look silly for making it.

 

[Ever Dawnracer]

[member="Reverance"]
That's cool. I don't really care.

I stand by my assumption.

 

[Runi Verin]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]

Well, we all know what happens when you assume, I guess.

 

[Tefka]

[member="Ever Dawnracer"]
If it helps calm the winds of conspiracy, it might be worthwhile to note that I am the one who subbed the initial rebellion suggestion, as in, me, the FO of the Galactic Alliance, who has absolutely no character in the Sith Empire. The second suggestion, this one, also comes from someone not remotely involved in the Sith Empire.

I think it's exorbitantly unfair for you to suggest these suggestions are because 'TSE is butthurt' when they're not even coming from them.

Especially when u read my post, yknow, when I directly reference reading this guys suggestion and how it led to this one.

But yeah, Tefs Sith Empire is a new meme, guess I’m embracing it. Can we get some actual work done if I do tho, cmon community, y’all are being especially unconstructive this time around.

Why am I getting the conspiracy/map wipers this time.

 

[Darth Ophidia]

[member="Tefka"] For Dark Lord 2019

 

[Tefka]

Unlocked this thread. I'm still open to Rebellion suggestions.

 

[Ashin Varanin]

I know raising the stakes isn't necessarily the best way to eliminate salt, but - and I'm just spitballing here - I feel like drama would decrease if major factions had better incentives to welcome or even invite Rebellions. Defeat means losing a hex, victory means keeping it and gaining two adjacent ones - that kind of thing. Thoughts?

 

[LT-137]

Rebellion's do cut into valuable time that could've been spent on Dominion's, so I think it's a decent trade-off if the successful Major is declared the winner. Following through with that idea might also make repeated rebellions a risky move, as if a major faction is consistently declared the winner, the minor faction would be giving their enemy more territory than they sought to deprive them of in the first place. A double-edged sword - if you will.

 

[Siobhan Kerrigan]

[member="Tefka"], [member="Valiens Nantaris"]


There's this thing called Flashpoints. Staff introduced them a long time ago...and then never used them for any of the subsequent rebellions. Copy pasted Flashpoint rules into the spoilered section:

Spoiler

FLASHPOINT RULES

• Flashpoints are the harbingers of chaos and chance, and represent random and sometimes naturally occurring events in the Galaxy of Star Wars RP: Chaos.
• In a Flashpoint where more than 2 sides are involved every IC post must clearly label the side being represented.

TARGETS OF FLASHPOINTS

• Every time a new Rebellion or Invasion is declared, a member of the SWRP Staff Team will roll a ten-sided die in the #dice_rolls discord channel. If the Rebellion/Invasion thread's roll lands on a 10, a Flashpoint is declared and the prefix of the thread is changed to Flashpoint.

FLASHPOINT MODIFIERS

• When a thread is declared a Flashpoint, it will follow a set of further rules in addition to the rules determined by the type of thread it was prior to becoming a Flashpoint.
• These rules are decided by a second 4-sided dice roll by Staff in the #flashpoint discord channel, and the corresponding number will decide which modifier to apply to the thread.
• A Role-play Judge will be assigned to a Flashpoint to ensure a modicum of law and to answer all questions arising from the Chaos.

REBELLION MODIFIERS

• If a 1 is rolled, the Rebellion is immediately crushed and the Flashpoint is to be treated as a successful Dominion.
• If a 2 is rolled, the Major Faction owning the planet has put up a blockade, limiting the amount of people from each Minor Faction that joins to a maximum of 5 characters.
• If a 3 is rolled, two adjacent hexes to this Rebellion (to be determined by Staff) are now also open to Rebellion for the next 10 days.
• If a 4 is rolled, Major Factions may also join the Rebellion and join either side.

INVASION MODIFIERS

• If a 1 is rolled, the victor will claim the two hexes closest (to be determined by staff) to the invasion hex from the losing Faction. These will be returned to neutral if dictated so by influence cloud rules.
• If a 2 is rolled, Requesting Aid restrictions are lifted.
• If a 3 is rolled, each participating Major Faction must invite a second Major Faction as an ally.
• If a 4 is rolled, a Minor Faction may declare Rebellion and join the invasion to make it a three way battle. If declared victorious Rebellion rules apply. Any further Minor Factions may join the Flashpoint by posting their intention in the OOC thread.

Perhaps staff should apply the rules it already introduced first, instead of making new ones. One might note that there's a faction mandate that prevent dominions from being rebelled (Hermit Kingdom).


Anyhow, if we're overhauling Rebellion rules, here's a suggestion:

• One dominion a month can be rebelled, but it can be any of the three possible. A major faction can gain an SSD if they win a rebellion or complete 3 dominions in a month.
• If the rebelling faction wins and decides to go major, they get the hex and the SSD.
• Don't wanna get rebelled? Get the appropriate mandate.
• If we want to limit minor factions a bit, a minor faction may only initiate a rebellion once every 3 months. Keeps minors from launching one rebellion after another.

I suppose Flashpoints would have to be reexamined if Rebellion rules are supposed to be changed. They've been around for quite a while, but have not been utilised. Personally I'd like to see a Flashpoint play out simply to see what happens. Of course, there is a high chance of nothing happening when a roll is made.

 

[Darth Voracitos]

I personally enjoy [member="Cradossk"]'s suggestion, as well as [member="Siobhan Kerrigan"]'s, though she brings up an even hairy point up:

Has staff actually engaged with the Flashpoint idea? I mean, I am aware that we'd only get a single flashpoint for every ten invasions/rebellions statistically, but it has been a long time since I've seen anything different imposed by staff on either an invasion or a rebellion. Has there been a Flashpoint yet? I haven't been aware of one happening, so if it happened it must not've been super well received. I also disagree with the idea that a rebellion could be instantly crushed, that seems more gamey than is necessary for an RP board.

Regardless of that, I think it is better to impose incentives on things, as opposed to creating rules of limitation. As rebellions currently stand, they are rather bland. Sure, if a rebellion wins they could ascend to major and gain a hex, or keep the hex neutral, but for a Major faction it was just a lot of headache to gather the equivalent of an ordinary dominion, and more than likely if they were going for a Flagship, it will be so delayed they will be denied it entirely just by the rebellion existing.

Siobhan's suggestion fixes much of this, by making an incentive for both sides to give their all and win. The rebellion should be motivated because if they win, not only do they get to decide what happens with the hex (and potentially gain an SSD right away if becoming major), they have also prevented the Major from getting additional hexes if the Rebelling faction had lost. For the major, it is patently obvious how it would benefit them greatly to be victorious, as not only do they get extra expansion to make up for potentially lost Dominions focusing on a Rebellion, but also acquire an SSD at the conclusion of the Rebellion, something they were potentially seeking prior to the Rebellion's intent being initiated.

I believe this would be a better solution that could make people more interested in a rebellion, as opposed to limiting how many can occur for minor factions, which are rarely active enough for more than one anyway, and gives them a potential thing to "lose" by failing to be victorious: their IC enemy grows stronger because of them.

 

[Tefka]

Everything said about Flashpoints are fair. There were... some serious conflicts in rolling those rules out.

Regardless, that’s Flashpoints, not Rebellions. I don’t wish to encourage Whataboutism, so let’s stay focused. Are Rebellions broken? Do they need fixes?

If so, what needs fixing?

 

[Tathra Khaeus]

I support what [member="Cradossk"] suggests.

 

[Ari Vox]

Anyhow, if we're overhauling Rebellion rules, here's a suggestion:

• One dominion a month can be rebelled, but it can be any of the three possible. A major faction can gain an SSD if they win a rebellion or complete 3 dominions in a month.
• 
  
• If the rebelling faction wins and decides to go major, they get the hex and the SSD.
• 
  
• Don't wanna get rebelled? Get the appropriate mandate.
• 
  
• If we want to limit minor factions a bit, a minor faction may only initiate a rebellion once every 3 months. Keeps minors from launching one rebellion after another.
• 
  

+1 I think the risk/reward in that if a Rebel force loses their enemy then receives the SSD they've been working towards, and if the Major loses then the Rebels get the SSD (should they choose to go major) seem pretty substantial. Would almost encourage rebellions moreso, and if they were limited to one every few months then it would open up the possibility for other minor factions to take on rebellions as well.

Honestly, I'm not sure that I see a reason that they're that big of a problem. I'm still quite new to the site, but I was a participant in the Rebellion of Dubrillion and that thread was fun! I saw a lot of interesting characters and made lots of interactions that I don't think I would have had available to me were it not in that precise context.

They're important as they are now, not to the point that they completely halt a major faction's story arch or progression, but it does add another layer of work onto their loads in that they need to rustle up enough writers to combat the threat.

Anyways, my $.02. Thanks for reading!

 

[Karacan Rigten]

[member="Cradossk"]

I agree with Cradossks suggestion. From an immersive standpoint, a failed Rebellion typically means a full, unexpected retreat. Realistically it would cause the minor faction to have many more casualties after turning tail and being shot at.

Literally it would cause most or all rebel forces nearby to leave their posts undefended, making little to no effort for the major faction to walk over and just plant their flag and secure the area anyway.

 

[Laira Darkhold]

Let's not dive into "realistically" in Star Wars RP. That's a dangerous road.

Rebellions in my opinion are meh. A major faction can churn out 2 doms a month with no risk if they wanted, and only minor factions that declare can join and only members of the major faction involved. It just seems like they don't have a lot of teeth like the used to "only hex dominions but that was the only quick way to expand" and thus I think they need a little umph.

I personally support [member="Siobhan Kerrigan"] s idea as it allows rebellions to happen more often. It could be any dominion that month, it makes certain mandates very good as some don't allow rebellions under certain conditions. It also gives incentives to both factions, the existing major can get an ssd off their very first dominion that month if they can defeat the rebelling one. The minor gets the option to go major with an ssd if they win. It adds some interesting stakes. Finally limiting the speed at which a minor may initiate rebellions will help some of the current issues without being so restrictive as once ever.