Star Wars Roleplay: Chaos

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Staff Second Chance

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[member="Popo"]

I realize the engine had been approved in the past. I am still concerned over propellers in outer space; it isn't if it is capable of being done, but more does it make sense in Star Wars. That was the reason why I inquired if it was possible to make it atmospheric only -- maybe with very limited outer space use for fast traveling within a planet so that it can come back down again? But no long term use beyond orbit?

How does that sound?
 

Popo

I'm Sexy and I Know It
[member="Cira"]
The ship has no hyperdrive capabilities, so it's limited enough in range. As for propellers in space, the ganathan navy has propellers on their spacecraft as seen on images on wookiepedia, specifically on the ship Robida Colossus. I understand entirely what you mean, but there's already propellers in space canonically.
 

Ciana Teigra

Guest
C
[member="Raziel"] Yes, I had gone on hiatus but I'm back now. It still looks to be archived, can I please have it removed to make the modifications for approval?
 

Rusty

Purveyor of Fine Weaponry
I would like to request a second chance for both of these submissions:

Axe That Shoots Other Axes That Also Shoot Wasps

Exploding Pillow that Makes Hot Chocolate

Both submissions were denied without due consideration. Yes, they are inherently silly, and somewhat impractical. However, they violate no rules. Both are based on technology that is firmly grounded within both the spirit and technology base of Star Wars, and they are in no way overpowered or unbalanced.

Denying them out of hand sets a dangerous precedent. The whole purpose of the review process is to ensure that ideas are realized, and that when they are introduced into the universe proper, they're fair and balanced. If we take it upon ourselves to police ideas for being silly or impractical, where does that stop? Do we demand that all submissions be utilitarian and practical? Does anything with a sense of whimsy get the ax?

Furthermore, they were both denied on the say so of a single individual. They weren't assigned to a judge for review. There was no discussion. Any submission in which there are concerns in relation to the viability thereof gets subjected to multiple sets of eyes and multiple opinions, in order to ensure that the fairest possible judgment is handed down. No single person, be they FJ, RPJ, or Admin, should have the power to unilaterally deny a sub, especially one that doesn't flagrantly violate the rules. This, again, sets a dangerous precedent, and one that I unequivocally condemn in the strongest possible terms as bad for the Factory and bad for the site.

Concerning specific issues with the submissions themselves, starting with the Axe That Shoots Other Axes That Also Shoots Wasps.

Yes, this is silly and impractical, but it is still a perfectly serviceable weapon. The materials involved are all commonly available. Leaving aside the fact that I'm not about to go out and catch some wasps to shove into the thing, I could probably knock up a working example at home. Well, at a buddy's workshop, maybe, since I don't keep the tools to do so in my closet. But the point still stands that any idiot with a working knowledge of metalwork and access to a Walmart could in theory put one together.

I would also contend that the whimsical nature of the submission is perfectly in line with the company that created it. Rusty's Custom Firearms and Cutlery has a reputation for building absurd and impractical weapons. We've weaponized the dad joke. At the behest of the site owner, we made a device that launches the Dantooine Plains Turkey at enemies while spewing out glitter and blaring stupid music. And also a bomb designed to be shoved up said turkey's cloaca. There's also a gun that shoots bees, one that can duct tape someone's mouth shut from across the room, and for one of the most powerful Sith Lords on the site, a rifle painted bright pink and decked out in Hello Kitty stickers. The axe in question is, yes, silly, but it barely registers on the impracticality scale, especially when you consider we have a cannon that uses atomic bombs as ammunition.

When you take that into consideration, this thing is downright dowdy.

As far as the pillow goes, I won't rehash the argument concerning its silliness or impracticality in relation to the rest of RCFC's products. However, I will point out that it's exactly the sort of thing one might get if you throw the creator in question in a thread with the character who requested the device, which we have. Point in fact, RCFC and Nadir are on course for a merger. This is exactly the sort of thing that Rusty would come up with on a drunken dare, and it's a plot point that was to occur in the near future.

The pillow is not overpowered. It's made using readily available technology. It's not, when you get down to it, an unreasonable security measure for an overly paranoid mercenary with a blasé attitude towards explosives. Put a flame retardant pillowcase on the thing and it's not even all that dangerous for everyday use. It's certainly a lot more comfortable than sleeping with a gun under a normal pillow.

[member="Cira"] [member="Raziel"]
 
[member="Popo"]

Second chance approved, as there is canon precedence with limited propeller technology using jet thrusters. I would just advise to please switch the image to something more evocative of Star Wars.

Popo said:
Intent: Because propeller planes in space and I wanted to see different ways canon technology can be used and utilized.
Please consider your intent. I do not want an increase of propeller planes in space. This second chance is granted under the understanding that it is held to the niche precedence of the Robida Colossus.

Please limit the availability of this being used in space and hyperspace as well.

Also, please change the image to a more appropriate one that can reflect the design.
 
tsarwars said:
http://starwarsrp.ne...ized-gauntlets/ Yeah, I believe it was denied unfairly. It was denied for not being in the star wars spirit, but i just wanted some melee weapon that is not a sword, because literally anything else is a type of sword.
It can be frustrating when a concept one would like to transfer over from one genre to the next doesn't seem possible.

Upon review, however, it appears that the weapon you are intending to create has far too many items for a simple gauntlet. Currently, we have nothing in canon that can back having the properties, components, and items required to provide three distinct lightsaber plasma beams from deploying from a gauntlet.

For this, let's review the components of a lightsaber:

ztigons1kufoipormrz5.png


As you can see, just by the sheer number of components, this takes up the space of typically 11 inches. That includes shoto lightsabers, as the only difference in the hilts is that a shoto lightsaber is slimmer and more streamlined -- not shorter.

In essence, you want a gauntlet that not only provides a shield, has 3 missiles plus the launcher, nets, and delivers stun darts each hand.

This isn't even including the parts and components you will need for all the rest of the gear you want.

Reasonably, it doesn't make sense to have all of this in one small area.

As it stands, this submission wouldn't be able to pass with the lightsaber components. In that aspect, a second chance would not be approved... However, i want to give you the chance to think about if you would simply like to work with the judge and work on what you currently have with the judge without using up your second chance sans the lightsaber claws?
 
Alright [member="Cira"] , i get the point. To be honest, i didn't think about the saber components not fitting in. Gonna work with the judge, remove the saber claws. Will find some other way to put them into Kyle's armament. Perhaps a different CQC gauntlet set? I believe that would work. Anyway, thanks for your patience, Cheers.
 
tsarwars said:
Alright [member="Cira"] , i get the point. To be honest, i didn't think about the saber components not fitting in. Gonna work with the judge, remove the saber claws. Will find some other way to put them into Kyle's armament. Perhaps a different CQC gauntlet set? I believe that would work. Anyway, thanks for your patience, Cheers.
Okay. I will move the submission to the Pre Factory so that you may be able to work on it without using up your second chance. When you are done editing, please tag me and I move it back to Technology, and I will tag the Factory judge who was reviewing your submission to look it over once more.
 
The darkness lays ever near the light.
I would to second chance this submission:
http://starwarsrp.net/topic/115685-torr-industries-holographic-movement-reflective-control-unit-mk1/

I believe that this was unfairly denied for two reasons:

1) I was not given a chance to edit the submission in any way shape or form - even when I waited for days for the judge to actually dish out his initial judgement.

2) It was denied on the grounds of "This is a Mecha. Denied.". I did not mention Mecha at any point during the submission and the concept I had - though similar to those of a different genre - is by no means far-fetched considering the technology that the Star Wars: Chaos Universe has at it's disposal. Also, the definition that the judge provided for a 'Mecha' made no sense as by the logic of "The term mecha (メカ meka) may refer to both scientific ideas and science fiction genres that centers on robots or machines controlled by people. Mechas are typically depicted as "walker" types of Mobile robots." then all walkers would be 'Mechas'.

Quite frankly (I don't mean to be rude, and I understand that it's not the judge's fault as everyone forgets things every so often) I am very disappointed at how long I had to wait for initial judgement on a submission that I worked hard on only for it to be denied without being given a chance to make edits.

Thanks in advance! [member="Cira"]
 
[member="Rusty"]

It can be frustrating when a submission has been denied outright without any edits being requested. Certainly when one believes that the item is relatively harmless. However, there were key distinct items that had me, as factory admin, deny the submissions outright.

I will not go over what has been approved or denied in the past. The subject in question are your two submissions. Outright denial is rarely, if ever, unless it appears that the item in question will be far beyond the original submission that it would be best suited as a new one.

Exploding pillow that makes hot chocolate.
An exploding pillow that hast the potential to completely vaporize within one radius and makes hot chocolate.
  • While you are able to create an exploding pillow, the idea that you are having it make hot chocolate as it explodes is farfetched. While I will be happy to grant you an exploding pillow, one that is also able to create hot chocolate is rather beyond what can be thought of in a Star Was setting. You may have your second chance to simply create an exploding pillow - if so you desire - but you'll need to remove the hot chocolate portion.

Axe That Shoots Other Axes That Also Shoot Wasps
In this submission, you currently have a regular ax, which the blade can separate to fire via rocks, other axes. In which the handle of the ax contains wasps to deploy and shoot.
  • I can grant you whimsy, but the Factory has outright denied submissions that go beyond the realm of what may be visible within Star Wars. Edits would have been asked to tone this down to something akin to a blast sword, which contains energy outlets or something similiar.

  • While there are blast swords within canon, having something along this vein isn't acceptable.
Should you so choose to take this direction, I would be happy to grant you a second chance of the axe, but with the removal of the wasps and the rocket propelled secondary axes.
 
[member="Darren Torran"]

I apologize that it took so long for the Factory Judge to review your submission. I will be emphasizing that if a Judge takes a submission to review, they must do the review within 48 hours or give notice as to why there is a delay.

Now, let's determine what is a Mecha.

Key Characteristics:

  • While the distinction is often hazy, mecha typically does not refer to form-fitting powered armor such as Iron Man's suit. They are usually much larger than the wearer, like Iron Man's enemy the Iron Monger, and possess a cockpit from which they are operated.
  • Generally either bipedal or quadrupedal in configuration, are controlled by human pilots and can thus be classified as mecha.
  • A mecha has a singular pilot. The actions of said pilot transferred directly to the actions of the mecha. By all accounts, it was an extension of the pilot itself.
  • Typically, Mecha contain an artificial skeleton and musculature, combined with a powerful gyroscope provide stability for the mech.
  • Some mechas, the entire system is controlled by a pilot wearing a neurohelmet that effectively links the 'Mech's central computer to the pilot's sense of balance and nervous system.

Now for Star Wars Definition of a Walker

A walker was any vehicle, usually military, that used legs as its primary method of locomotion rather than the more common repulsors, wheels, or treads. The term could also refer to especially large droids with legs (usually combat droids), though such droids were usually referred to using more specific terminology (such as "spider droid"). The All Terrain series contained some of the most well known examples of walkers. The designs for walkers utilized by the Galactic Empire were directly inspired by the successful use of animal cavalry from ancient civilizations

Some smaller walkers are as follows:

Clone Personal Walker :The Clone Personal Walker was a bipedal walker used by clone troopers in the Clone Wars.It could carry only one clone trooper with equipment and rations. It carried 1 twin laser canon and crewed 1 pilot, fulfilling the roll of heavy calvary and self propelled artillery.


ATPT: AT-PTs were made to take single troopers into intense combat situations on their own, with the firepower of a squad. They stood only three meters tall, and were driven by AT-PT pilots.The walkers were capable of reaching speeds up to 60 kilometers per hour and could climb a 45-degree angle, with hydraulic adjusters keeping the unit balanced. The vehicles carried a long-range comm antenna for patrols. The main drive unit provided power and hydraulic pressure for the two legs, and featured cooling vents. The cockpit entry hatch was on the side, while the emergency flare launcher was just above the viewport.

What we can surmise is that while a mecha is by all accounts, an extension of the Pilot's physical body, a walker is just a vehicle that is only that, a mounted vehicle that can transport from point a and b upon a bipedal ( or more legs) means.

Upon review of your submission, here is the area that suggests that your submission is more of a "mecha" than a "walker."

Smoother Movement: The pilot having full control over the upper body of the walker means that it moves much smoother and similar to a sentient being.
Walkers should not be able to move as smoothly as if they have sentience.



Darren Torran said:
Holographic: The unit projects two holographic 'gauntlets' that detect the movement of the pilot's arms


Darren Torran said:
Must be Integrated during Manufacturing: The unit must integrated during the manufacturing process - eliminating the option of it being used in the manufacturing of any walkers without explicit permission.


Darren Torran said:
It allows the pilot of a Bi-Pedal walker (providing said walker has arms) to control the upper body (from the waist up) of the machine. The advantage of using this unit compared to the conventional controls is it's ability to allow smoother movement in the arms of the walkers that reflects that of a sentient being.

This suggests that much like Battle Mech, the walker must be integrated and move in conjunction with the pilot to be able to work properly.


I can see the factory Judge's reasoning that this appears to be much like a Mecha. The way that it is able to interact to the pilot to move far more streamlined and as an extension of the pilot itself can define it as one.

The general intent of you submission " Intent: To create a unique way of controlling walkers that reflects the movement of the pilot's upper body." suggests that this was your intention from the start. Requested edits to change it from being so similiar to a mecha may ultimately defeat the purpose of your submission.

However, do you believe there is any way that you can make your submission be less reliant on the pilot's motions and streamlining so as to become more a vehicle instead of a mecha?

If so, i would be happy to approve your second chance and move your submission to Pre Factory so that you may edit accordingly, or simply create a new one based off those recomendations.
 
The darkness lays ever near the light.
[member="Cira"]

Perhaps instead of moving like arms the unit can be used on any walker as a way of controlling it's weapon and defence systems using simple hand gestures? Would this be at all viable?
 
[member="Darren Torran"]

Do you mean that you just want to instead make a holographic method of control as an additional component for any walker to aid in controlling its defense systems?

If you basically mean can you make a HUD version of walker control, that's fine. Just as long as it doesn't involve integrating the pilot with a type of battlemech as an extension of their own body. That would then make it more of a mecha than an actual personal walker.

If that is agreeable, I can approve this second chance.
 
The darkness lays ever near the light.
Cira said:
[member="Darren Torran"]

Do you mean that you just want to instead make a holographic method of control as an additional component for any walker to aid in controlling its defense systems?

If you basically mean can you make a HUD version of walker control, that's fine. Just as long as it doesn't involve integrating the pilot with a type of battlemech as an extension of their own body. That would then make it more of a mecha than an actual personal walker.

If that is agreeable, I can approve this second chance.
Essentially, yes.
 
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